I received this text message from a friend who fortunately is one of those who has not only read history but also never forget it.
“Richard the Lionheart fought the crusades against Muslims who were valiantly defended by Salahuddin Ayubi. In operation LionHeart, who is lion heart in present context? Can somebody ask Gen Ather Abbas?”
Since, I was running fever and hadn’t watched TV or read newspaper for a couple of days; I ask him that what operation Lionheart is? He informed me that joint operation of Pakistani and ISAF forces in FATA is named operation Lionheart. I then forwarded that text message to my favorite hosts and was lucky to get reply from two of them. In their reply they told me that they would ask the question as the next day they were meeting Gen Abbas in Seminar in the Capital. To my knowledge, till these lines are typed, no has asked this questions on-air, may be due to the censor policies of their channels.
However, the messages like these are roaming through cellular network;
“Now the crusades against Muslims of Pakistan and Afghanistan have been named operation Lionheart after the title of crusader King Richard who fought against Salahudin Ayubi for four years and massacred each and every Muslim in Al-Quds when he conquered it for a brief period. The US Army, NATO and (some of the words are edited here) our own army are operating together under the operation Lionheart, there is no doubt left for the real Muslims and Pakistanis to recognize who their clear enemies are! If you love Islam and Pakistan now is the time to stand and fight for our Faith and Country.”
We can easily call these text messages, the views of radicals, extremists, illiterates, conservatives, enemies of free society and social change and so on. But we can’t deny the truth that speaks very loud between the lines. Whether it should be a matter of our Faith or not, it’s debatable as there are the people who still believe this is “our own War”. But what is the reason and intention behind naming an operation against Muslim, no matter extremist or moderate, after the name of a cruel crusader KINGS?
It’s a new world, a cyber world, an era of information. I hope our forces and agencies would not loose their energy on making way out to shut the month speaking truth, but answering these simple question such as;
- Why has a joint operation in FATA named after crusaders?
- Is this a Slip of pin like the slip tong by Mr Bush right after 9/11 when he termed the war on terror as a Crusade?
- Is it a deliberate act of western forces who think that Muslim masses would be stupid like their leadership and would have forgotten their history?
My friends are suggested to visit the following links for reading about Richard Lionheart. It will be also healthy for those responsible for dealing with western powers to visit the recommended Links.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_I_of_England
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/historic_figures/richard_i_king.shtml
http://www.eyewitnesstohistory.com/crusades.htm
http://www.templarhistory.com/richard.html
http://www.jasarat.com/unicode/detail.php?category=8&coluid=241
Especially this one, Slaughter in the Desert
http://www.eyewitnesstohistory.com/lionheart.htm
Comments
59 responses to “Operation LionHeart”
Salaam brother, has the name of the operation been confirmed by a credible source? (My apologies if I didn’t quite understand)
I will of course support your post with a post of my own. If true, this makes it abundantly clear where the priorities of Muslims lie and reveals the War of Terror to be what we always knew it was – a war against Islam.
Wow! nice turn!
Now we can not blame Israel and Jews for everything that wrong with us. Didn’t Richard mercilessly massacred the Jews too? At least Israel gets its slate clean in this operation in FATA!
yesterday talat i guess mentioned it in his program but very vaguely i didnt get it then but now somehow got an idea why.
Operation Lion Heart or Pig Heart …doesn’t matter! What matters is that the Pak Army along with American’s crush the Talibans and anyone standing up – especially the Arabs, Checans, Uzbiks & Afghan and anyone who comes in between – they deserve it!
@Shahid
Yes it has been officially announced.
@ New M Q M slogan Pak-Army USA-Army Bhai Bhai
crushing mainly all “pathans” Altaf’s bad lover,
creating rivalries with Punjabis, another bad lover,
Perhaps ask these Armies to go for operation
“clean-up the empuration plant of 90 Azizabad “
Don’t worry you lot.Let the bogus Muslims and their equally mercenary governments and organizations keep sucking up to the crusaders ,as the real Salahuddins keeping increasing all the way from Palestine to Iran over Pakistan and some Central Asian Republics to China.
God has his plans;it is unfolding and the crusaders will be buried.
Dear People of Pakistan
Time of Saladin and Richard the Lions Heart is History.Can we stop reacting like opium eaters ?Which crusade?
This war is against terrorism.
In case you have not got it.
TERRORIST THINK YOUR ISLAM IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH and YOU ARE NOT GOOD ENOUGH MUSLIM BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT in his camp ,which is SUICIDE BOMBER SO HE SEES NO DIFFERENCE IN MUSLIMS of Pakistan AND USA.
@Hasan Abbas
Salahuddin is on the scene now, from Palestine to Far-East, this time unarmed and uneducated and without any plans.
i don’t understand what is the fuss.
our army is a mercenary army, a hired hand if you pay them even for bombing “KABA TULALLAH” they will not think twice.
This is the history of pakistan army.
The slogan of eiman,jihad and tanzeem is just for the non commissioned muslim soldiers.in order to satisfy and make them sacrifice their lives.
Dr Jawad Khan
After writing this comment I am on vaccation from politics.
For your comment has given me enough blood pressure,anger and frustration and humiliation.I really need to recover from it.
Just one question,without Pakistan army and Pakistan people whom would you like to serve with your knowledge and degree?
Pakistan army and Pakistan people are dying we are in a loss from all sides can you abstain from commiting verbal suicide?
For I value you and your degree.
People inspired by glorious past of Islam.See this picture,Pakistan created in the name of Islam has been to war with India.No ISlamic country came to our help.
Iraq was bombarded like rain with bombs ,no Islamic country
stood with them.
Palestine is fighting its own war.We are not going there to die.When Afghanistan was attacked Musharaff saved Pakistan.
This escape is not in vision now.We stand alone.islamic world exist and has recetly agreed that for all major festivals we will follow th eappearence of moon as per Saudi Arabia.
We got Pakistan because in second world war muslims of India agreed to fight under the banner of British Raj.
World has completely changed ,Business and oppertunity is the survival.
In this survival of the big sharks if we think Saudi Arabia or Iran will fill our tanks or F16 for free ,we are mistaken.
We need to broad our vision it is not a war of Islam.It is a war of superamacy in the region.
It will be far better for the survival of Pakistan to look towards China.
When fata is bombarded or when Karachi was masacred ,no one came to help.No one saved us.We have to save ourselves.
Why Arab sheikhs are investing in Europe and USA not in Pakistan?Which Islamic world are we talking about.If Islamic world has to reappear,we have to rebuild ourselves on the very foundations first.Let us learn to walk before we are lured into fights with swords ,it is a game of buttons now.
Do not press the wrong buttons,Fuse urh jata hai.Mazrat kai sath iske angrazi nahei aatee.
@ farrah k raja “After writing this comment I am on vaccation from politics”.
It is a pity you couldn’t stay away on vacation ,and had to post two spiritless and faithless comments.Time of Saladin and Richard the Lions Heart may be history for you.But IT IS HISTORY for many Muslims -and quite obviously US forces in Afghanistan too;and those who don’t learn from history are fated to be failures.
And when we talk of fighters we are talking of real muslims fighters not psuedo muslims like Arab sheiks,or so called Muslim armies and rulers.Which world are you living in?Even if it has to go on for a thousand years America will have to leave from here in ruins-the world shall see.
@Unaiza Fatima:”Salahuddin is on the scene now, from Palestine to Far-East, this time unarmed and uneducated and without any plans “. …..And for seven years these unarmed and uneducated and without any plans” have fought The US to a state that they need 3 more brigades ,and even then they are saying there is no military solution,and be seaching the Taliban to talk?????
@Rafay Kashmiri,
Why are you sending Paki forces for operation to 90? Why not the US army? Only because they pay to you (if you’re ZH yourself) or to your master, Zaid Hamid (if you’re not ZH)? What hypocrisy! How obedient you’re to real masters?
Look, MQM is a gang but after all these are from us. Police should deal with them. The armies are supposed to be Chaukidar and the role of chaukidar is to fight forces of outside. Right? Hope you got it.
Why not the US army?*
This part of my comments should be read ” why not to fight with US forces”
@farah k raja!
Was it really necessary to answer?
“Just one question, without Pakistan army and Pakistan people whom would you like to serve with your knowledge and degree?
Did I say some thing about people of Pakistan?
By the way, I am working in saudia.
Verbal suicide?……..no I call it a collective suicide.
People are dying because of the venality and worst sequacious mentality of people who rule this country (including Pakistan army)
Because Pakistan is like their “highly profitable investment” and they want to save it at any cost. Because Pakistan is not an ideological state for these people.
Because of this mentality one American said in live televised show that “for the money Pakistani can sell their mothers.
Do not value me or my degree.
Just open your dictionary and search the words like HONOR, SELF RESPECT, DIGNITY and IDEOLOGY.
Your BP is going high? Do not take any medicine for that because modern science still not been able to invent a tranquillizer which can sedate the conscience.
Hi Jawwad
Thank you for your professional advice :)lol
My bloodpressure is quite fine.Jawwad it is nothing personal,we all love Pakistan and want it to be a better place.
Your comment”Did I say some thing about people of Pakistan?
Paksitan army is no different from people of Pakistan.At least I see them as one.
Your comment:Verbal suicide?……..no I call it a collective suicide.
I agree with this one.
HOW WE SAVE OURSELVES FROM USA AND TERRORISTS ,end of the day it is us the people deying.
If the army would not stand against Terrorism against USA and ALLAH FORBID ,if they fail where do we stand.
That is what India is asking ,”WHEN SHOULD THEY ATTACK PAKISTAN Because they think Mujahedeen would target them next.”
In this situation,we have to work together,we have enemy within and outside.
We need a whole debate on this Terrorism and Jihad acctually.
As you said you reside in Saudia ,just post one comment to let people of Pakistan know in past few years how many terorist attacks have taken palce in Saudia and how many arrests government of Saudia has made.
What is the punishment for such people?
NOTE:THIS IS NOT PERSONAL,LET US TRY TO UNDERSTAND THE Situation
Hassan Abbas
” and had to post two spiritless and faithless comments.”
so what does your SPRIT and FAITH says,
BLOW FARRAH UP ,She is faithless and spiritless and perhaps Angrezee speaker .That is the judgement of God inside you.
Dear All,
Our discussion and fighting in the name of disagreement shows that we haven’t studied our history but the western powers are dead sure about what they are doing. The name “Operation Lionheart” is a deliberate act.
If you listen to the Christian right – the Evangelical – the so-called “war-on-terrorism” is a religious crusade. And the evangelical’s Armageddon battle cry may fulfill what a deluded people believe to be biblical prophecy.
“Bush’s use of the word “crusade” to describe his “war on terrorism” is certainly the play thing of such forces as the geopolitics of [vital resources] but it seems that he is susceptible to other even darker archetypal concerns. Let me be blunt. The man is delusional and the shape of his delusion is specifically apocalyptic in belief and intent. That Bushiites [Establishment] would attack so many vital systems on so many fronts may seem confusing from the point of view of realpolitik but becomes transparent in terms of the apocalyptic worldview to which they subscribes. All systems are supposed to go down so the Messiah can come and the [Establishment], seemingly, has taken on the role of the one who brings this to pass,” say Morgan Strong a former professor of Middle Eastern History at S.U.N.Y.
“Jewish fundamentalists of course do not believe in Revelations but have nonetheless made common cause with the Christian Right. It’s a very tragic situation in which Christian fundamentalists, certain groups of them that focus on Armageddon and the Rapture and the role of a war between Muslims and Jews in bringing about the Second Coming, are involved in a folie a deux with extremist Jews,” said Ian Lustick, the author of “For the Land and the Lord.”
But what this article is trying to say is that not only the Bushiites Establishment are playing into this delusion, but our own Establishment’s mercenaries have bartered their soul for some USDs. It is equally repulsive to hear some on this blog falling for this nonsense, too! Yes, we have our own problems with “our” gangs and equally deluded ones from the twilight zones that should be dealt within our own laws and law enforcement. But “our discussion and fighting in the name of disagreement shows that we haven’t studied our history but the western powers are dead sure about what they are doing. The name “Operation Lionheart” is a deliberate act,” as aptly said by Talkhaba.
@farrah k raja!
This issue is so sensitive and so exemplary that every one gets personal.
can you tell me why we love Pakistan? Inspite of appalling injustices, soul killing inequities, flustering economy, uncontrolable lawlessness and rampant corruption.
because of a unique attachment gifted by Allah (swt) along with Pakistan. it is an ideology with out this ideology Pakistan would be a body without soul.
Pakistan army has the biggest share of this loathful perverted and deflective deviation from the ideology.
i can give many examples about the crimes directly and indirectly committed by Pakistan army from rape and murder of Bengalis to barbaric and swinish massacre of innocent women and children of jamia hafsa.
This army never hesitated to use the phosphorus bomb against helpless women and children. how can one proud of this rogue army.
From selling the ordinary Pakistanis to the criminal and intentional negligence in fact owning of massacre carried out by american army.
deviation from eiman jihad and tanzeem to war against terorrism to save highly profitable investment.
Tell me who fought the war against Soviet Union and now fighting against America. Why a super power with high tech weaponry is losing war against poor and almost unarmed(compare to america)civilians? Afghanistani army is not fighting against americans.It is afghan Taliban who are doing jihad against america.
Tell me who defended the starved and poor Vietnam against a super power. It is ordinary people with intact affiliation with ideology.
So please do not tell me what will happened with out army, think what is happening with army who have nuclear weapons and considered to be the third best army in the world.
Interesting thing about army that, this army is very sensitive about its authority No prime minister can dare to dismiss the army chief (even the constitution gives him the right to dismiss). army get mad if some one do that but when a super power who nourishes it’s bastard children ( the generals ), uses barbaric force against the citizens of Pakistan these bastard children receive guard of honor with out turning a hair.
You should understand that it is the affiliation with ideology, which defends the nation not the biped animal with nice uniform and high tech weapon.
In the end I am sorry (not penitent) for my language but you should understand that these are the sentiments of a man who saw an extremely painful defeat of an ideology.
@farrah k raja!
This issue is so sensitive and so exemplary that every one gets personal.
can you tell me why we love Pakistan? Inspite of appalling injustices, soul killing inequities, flustering economy, uncontrolable lawlessness and rampant corruption.
because of a unique attachment gifted by Allah (swt) along with Pakistan. it is an ideology with out this ideology Pakistan would be a body without soul.
Pakistan army has the biggest share of this loathful perverted and deflective deviation from the ideology.
i can give many examples about the crimes directly and indirectly committed by Pakistan army from rape and murder of Bengalis to barbaric and swinish massacre of innocent women and children of jamia hafsa.
This army never hesitated to use the phosphorus bomb against helpless women and children. how can one proud of this rogue army.
From selling the ordinary Pakistanis to the criminal and intentional negligence in fact owning of massacre carried out by american army.
deviation from eiman jihad and tanzeem to war against terorrism to save highly profitable investment.
Tell me who fought the war against Soviet Union and now fighting against America. Why a super power with high tech weaponry is losing war against poor and almost unarmed(compare to america)civilians? Afghanistani army is not fighting against americans.It is afghan Taliban who are doing jihad against america.
Tell me who defended the starved and poor Vietnam against a super power. It is ordinary people with intact affiliation with ideology.
So please do not tell me what will happened with out army, think what is happening with army who have nuclear weapons and considered to be the third best army in the world.
Interesting thing about army that, this army is very sensitive about its authority No prime minister can dare to dismiss the army chief (even the constitution gives him the right to dismiss). army get mad if some one do that but when a super power who nourishes it’s bastard children ( the generals ), uses barbaric force against the citizens of Pakistan these bastard children receive guard of honor with out turning a hair.
You should understand that it is the affiliation with ideology, which defends the nation not the biped animal with nice uniform and high tech weapon.
In the end I am sorry (not penitent) for my language but you should understand that these are the sentiments of a man who saw an extremely painful defeat of an ideology.
Jawwad
Thanks for your post.I understand every word of it.It is extremely hurting and whole of Pakistan is going through this dilemma .My question is why we are being tried so much,in the name of our patriotism,in the name of our faith.
The questions you have raised are genuine.A huge percentage of Pakistan population is asking these questions?
Our religious,political leaders,journalists ,media people should answer these questions.
Zardari is a president for you and for me.Pakistan is a country for you and for me.Who is making us stand against each other?Be it religion be it army.
After all it is a country created for muslims.Here we are not talking about what is your choice for vote.
Country and its army is to protect its people.If the people have this huge anti army sentiment.This should be addrssed by the politicians.
You do not want to loose this country neither do I.Nor the rest of people.What is happening in Bajour ,what happened in Karachi no political leader has given us any answers.
Benazir,Zardari,Iltaf Hussain although from Karachi never brought any re-conciliation.
I think unfortunately the responsibility of saving Pakistan is on your shoulders and mine and on every Pakistani.Nobody is giving us any answers or any healing.
It does not mean we leave our country to dogs or to USA to bbombard us or to India to ocnvince the world that we do not deserve a country in first place.Are we going to save Afghanistan or our own house.
Pakistan army is made up of Pakistani people some have point of view like mine ,some have like yours .The question is what is our collective conciousness?
Our leaders ,media has done nothing to answer this question the gulf is widening and it is horrifying ….where would we stand in next twenty years.
People of Pakistna have to ocme up with solution.Current situation there are two solutions,one is we say yes we are muslims ,we would not fight against Talibaan,we would not fight against Al qaeda,we will not investigate the foriegners in Pakistan.
Do what ever you want to do ?Of course the answer is clear what will happen.
This is what Talibaan said to USA for OSAMA
We are being attacked by USA at present as well,if Paksitan Army has to fight at this time its own people as well.
this is getting too long.Regarding Afia ,I am sorry for her situation,but as you are in Saudia you know if you are wanted by them if you run to Pakistan>pakistan has this International obligation to hand over you back to Saudia.
I am in Britan so if I am wanted by British government in any fraud Pakistan has to hand me over.
Afia as per my knowledge is a US citizen.USA has a right over her.I cannot stay in Britan and work against it and think I am safe in Pakistan.
terrorist and peadophiles and murderers cannot escape the punishment and law any more ,does not matter if they are US citizen,British or Pakistan.
Pakistan is in the middle of international conflict,January 2009 will decide our fate.
It is sad we have so many internal conflicts and no leader to address this situation.
best of luck and best wishes we all need it
thanks for being so calm and listening.i never met an “enlightend moderate” who is ready to listen and understand the feelings of masses.no one can disagree what you said in your post EXCEPT the last few lines:
“this is getting too long.Regarding Afia……..terrorist and peadophiles and murderers cannot escape the punishment and law any more ,does not matter if they are US citizen,British or Pakistan”
don’t you think you were some what tricky in these lines.700 innocent people were sold to america entertaint the joy of “ENLIGHTENED MODERATION” IN guantanamo bay cuba.
and believe me most of them are ordinary pakistani citizens with one thing common……. faith
please listen to the voices rising with in the united states of america on the blatant injustice
read the writers who met those poor victims of enlightend moderation. i am sure you will never say:
“terrorist and peadophiles and murderers cannot escape the punishment and law any more ,does not matter if they are US citizen,British or Pakistan”
by the way saudia never handed over it’s citizen to any country.they punish by themselves.
Jawad
Laughing at “Enlightend Moderate”.The thing is I am so fed up of my political and history books I want to find out my own truth ,I want to listen to my people.For it hurts,my people in the wrold are Pakistani people where ever they are.
You are right we haev made mistakes in handing over these people to USA ,We should have a trial for them first in Pakistan.Pakistan government should say to USA,hang on a second we have a nation too.We are answerable too and we need to find our version of truth too.
My only reservation is few Brits of Pakistani origin were captured in Afghanistan and sent to guantanamoubay,they are free people today.
If they had been in Pakistan,I am sorry to say I do not expect a fair trial.probably these people would have been hanged.
The problem is HUM JAIN TU JAIN KAHAN?
Your point is right though.
Jawad
I am not tricky ,only I had made a point of view ,with ready made view I am trying to see your side.So I am rejudging my own judgement.
Pleasure to have conversation with you.I must let you know I was afraid and tense to pick this dialogue but you did justice to your education .I hope I did to mine as well.
God Bless us all
Farrah
@Farah,
Hassan Abbas
” what does your SP(i)RIT and FAITH says,
,She is faithless and spiritless and perhaps Angrezee speaker .That is the judgement of God inside you”.
Farah perhaps my English may be better then yours-so I have nothing against Anglo Pakistanis.I was trained for over two years at one of UK’s premier institutions.I did my junior school from convents -and high school from one of Pakistan’s best public school -in the days when English men and women could still be principals and head mistresses in our educational institutions.
But I have studied Islam;and Christianity – and American history too-seriously as research subjects, and not through magazines and drawing room discussions as most of us do.
Faith and spirit have nothing to do with the judgement of God -as those who know Islam well understand…and they have everything to do with Muslim brotherhood; Honor, Truth, Self Respect,Dignity ,Justice,and humanity.If you had really studied the divergence in American practice and preachings as it dealt with all -not just Muslims, we come at the tail end (Red Indians;Canadians;Mexicans;
Spanish;Cubans;Filipnos;Europeans;Japanese in that historical order)- you would know what I am talking about.
“BLOW FARRAH UP’is a typical comment one would expect from western or western educated self centered people.They forget that the bomber blows himself up too;But do not wish to face the question -or even solve the issue which gave rise to it – why?
This does not mean I like the bomber or what he does. I probably have more reason to hate him-for he may not blow up Farah ;but if he gets half a chance he would love to ‘dispatch Hassan Abbas Mushriq to hell’.
But I respect him because despite his lack of education,misguidance and the divisive way he has gone about his war;he at least is prepared even to die to save his nation from American arrogance and tyranny.
So when I talk of Salahudins I do not necessarily mean the Taliban.Many others ,including Hamas and Iran are managing their confrontation in a much better manner .
“Farah perhaps my English may be better then yours” HAHAHAHHAAHA…that’s a perfectly constructed sentence.
What “premier” institute did you go to again?
Oh btw, don’t bother picking on me with a comeback line, I’ll spare you the trouble, I went to a ‘peela’ school.
Hassan and Solidify
It would have been far better if you would have tried to approach Farrah the human, the thought.
Now on my standard of English what can I say?Apart from humanity and peace has no language and English spellings could cause a civil war in words of Bernard Shaw.
I have no shame when it comes to spelling or grammar or English.In life my school time is over and I would rather explore my thinking and people than spellings and improving Engrezi standard.
@Farrah:
Woah! Calm down lady… My comment was aimed at Hasan Abbas and not you. Read my comment again… I quoted his sentence and commented on it, not yours.
Solidify
“Woah! Calm down lady”,Good advise ,I need it.
Sorry I just approached your note with a pre-conception ,here it comes again,the criticism.
Sometimes I am sentimental of the continental :):)
It seems my problem is I cannot rest in peace without politics and cannot handle it either.
Learning starts here.Thanks for being kind and genereous.
It helps:)
Dear Sir (Hasan Abbas)
Only after Solidify reminded me,I went back to your comment and read it properly.Recently I have been criticised so much for typing errors,spellings and my thoughts ,that when I read oppening lines of your comment I thought again the words of war…….
Thanks for taking time out and typing your thoughts despite
my ignorance and arrogance.
I have to learn a lot from you particularly regarding your comment on Suicide Bomber.
I genuinely want to know what is giving rise to suicide bombers.I think it is brain washing and 70 virgins.
I have not read American history ,so I would like to listen to your point how you see their behaviour?
After humanity and religion I respect scholars and I am so hungry for the words which I listen from Pakistani Scholars.
And yes maybe now I sound like a Westerner but I am educated from Pakistan,I am self centered and I am isolated in my thought process.
It will be a blessing if I can get real knowledge and teaching from my people who have the experience as well.
Sir please I will be waiting for your response.
Take good care of yourself.We need you.
TEETH MAESTRO
Here is the classic sentence by DR JAWWAD KHAN
“Your BP is going high? Do not take any medicine for that because modern science still not been able to invent a tranquillizer which can sedate the conscience.”
Highly recommended for
CLASSIC QUOTATION ON TEETH MAESTRO.
@ Talkhaba succeded in creating a fitnah ! and left
for a corner.
Crusades were nearly forgotten, its these Neocons
of American evangelist buggers who re-triggered this
dirty subject. Was’nt Bush who asked for crusades
against talibans right after 9/11 ?. And Talkhaba waited
for today to bring it out before us, to deviate our
attention from his total defeat on Zaid Hamid’s
subject ! yes this epuration center in 90 Azizabad
will be cleaned, inshallah.
@ Solidify,
take care of your bp, don’t blow up your brains
for nothing. Btw, are you solidified with F or M ?
@ Farrah,
yes, read Pakistani Scholars, not seculars/marxist
or agnostics and nakli angrez. Read Mushtaq Ahmed
Youssufi !!
English is not even a language, its a dialect of
Germanic with idiotic grammar and pronunciation of
a constipated donkey. Why are you disputing on a
lingo which is not even yours. Urdu is the Greatest
of the languages on earth.
@ Farrah K Raja,
do you know the song by late Talat Mehmood,
” Jain to Jain Kahan ” ?
Unka bhi gham he, apna bhi gham he
ab dil ke bachnay ki umeed kam he
ik kashti sau tofaan, jain to jain kahan !!!
I wish I could send Talkhaba on crusades, with an
audio cassette, with the above song !!!!
@Rafay Kashmiri
Firstly, you have one Zaid Hamid and nothing else in this world. Secondly, I’m still there in Ziad Zaman’s post of teeth maestro and also there at IslamabadObserver but I have other topics also. Thirdly, I had forwarded this message to Zaid Hamid on his cell phone but he didn’t answer the reasons known to all of us. What has made to bark here as I have put up simple questions before our army spokesman about naming an operation after the name of a crusader king? We will never support this topic for the reason I know and will share with others. Dear readers this Raffay kashmiri is Zaid Zaman Hamid himself and he is the mouth piece of our army general rather their Dalal, so we don’t expect that he will tell the truth or support the truth. At ZH post we have presented so many proofs but these guys still bark.
Rafay Kashmiri
Are you Zaid Hamid though?Since I live abroad I have not watched any programes of yours neither intend to.
Well I have read all the literature which you mentioned including Mushtaq Ahmed Yousfi.
I do not know URDU main kaisai lartai hain?Angrezee main galian daina bhi asaan hai or I am sorry kehna bhee.
Urdu lekhtai sharam aatee hai kiyounkai na tu main khushkhat houn aur na kabhee Ashfaq Ahmed kai pai ki Urdu likh saktee houn.Lehaza angrezze main waisai he merai sarai kasoor mauf hain.Baqool mery Engrezi Teacher ,Angrezi meri maan nai ijaad nahein kee the.
COMING TO THE POINT ,IF YOU ARE ZAID HAMID ,you do not have to hide.IF YOU WOULD NOT OWN YOURSELF HOW WOULD OTHERS RELATE TO YOU
@farrah k raja!
now you gave me a real headache in coming few days i will analyse that wether this is satirical remark or is it a humor?(my sense of humor stopped working since some time) but i take it as a compliment.thanks a lot.
TALKHABA
I do not think this post is FITNA of any kind.It is prickling to our souls.At least I have confronted my confusions and it has enabled me to understand conflicting point of views.
Pakistan Army if has chosen this name ,it is lack of political vission,if they agreed with already chosen name from USA ,they should have negotiated to change it.
To me it is not important actually ,what is important is ,we are deying ,what ever name they give it.
Maybe that is what the Army men thought,they would be too much consumed into planning and strategy and maybe they have not got the luxury to sit and think ,how this name would affect people.
REST ASSURED WE HAVE NO MORE SALADIN AND NO MORE RICHARD THE LION HEARTS any more.WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH VERY MEAN And SCOUNDRL BUSINESS MEN.THESE PEOPLE ARE DRIVEN WITH GREED.
Behind the mask what is the difference between Zardari and Bush?
THOUGHT & CONCIOUS PROVOKING !!!!!
@farrah k raja
Which post is not fitna? I haven’t termed any post a fitna. We have the right to discuss and expose the life of those who pretends to be good but have some hidden agendas, which are incompetent but show that they know all.
I agree with you, we should be killed, we should not die. But who will convince the Dalals of those who are part of team murdering us?
Hi Talkhaba
”
Rafay Kashmiri said in his comment
@ Talkhaba succeded in creating a fitnah ! and left
for a corner.”
I wanted to emphasise that I do not agree with Rafay.
It is not a Fitna but actually other way round.It has allowed me to face my fears and resolve my inner conflicts.
THANKYOU FOR THE POST Talkhaba
Dr Jawwad
Rest assured this is the best line I have read in modern literature which so aptly describes 21 century and humanity.
@ Farrah,k. raja,
No, I am not Zaid Hamid , I don’t even know him,
just began to know him few months ago, thru his videos
and was delighted and excited, although living abroad
in the heart of Europe, I saw quite few of his videos
with a group of my friends. Talkhaba has picked up
some suspected virus of personaltiy conflict, he
suspects and insist that I am disguised or reincarnated
in Zaid, there is certainly a short circuit in between
his two ears. “grey matter” ( matiére gris ).
your Urdu is not at all bad, keep it up, speak, listen,
watch Urdu, even think in Urdu.
Thanks Rafay
It has been ages since I have read Urdu,If I ever tink in Urdu that is during my work journey,and often it is Ghalib and of course it is baiwazan.
Mughai kiya bura tha merna gar aik bar houta
and
Hum kounsai dana thai kis hunar main yakta thai
Kiyoun huwa Ghalib dushman aasman hamara.
Rafay Kashmiri
Please do not be sarcastic I want to discuss something serious .How long will it take for us the Pakistanis to accept that “Quami Tarana is not in Farsi but in Urdu”
I am not ready to accept anymore that Pakistan Ka Quami Tarana Farsi Main hai.
The words are originally from Farsi but now they are part of Urdu.
How long will it take us the Pakistani people to start owning ourselves.
If you disagree please do?Somehow I am not ready to accept Quami Tarana udhar ki zaban main likha gaya hai.
Farah,
“Farah perhaps my English may be betters than yours” is neither a comment on your English nor on your spellings, it was only meant to amplify the point that I have nothing against what wrote about yourself: “and perhaps Angrezee speaker’. Only dim wits like Solidify whose brains are frozen solid -and manners who never learnt from their mama or papa – would think blogs and comments their on or supposed to be Essays in the ‘kings English’ style. Though I suspect he is either a yank or prefers Yankee English.
I must thank you for your considerate reply. I give below a link to an article I posted on an Indian blogs setup to educate Indians on whom to blame for terrorists, Taliban and bombers. I also give a link to an article on how the Americans behaved against their own Christians. This is because you expressed the wish:
“I have not read American history, so I would like to listen to your point how you see their behavior?
After humanity and religion I respect scholars and I am so hungry for the words which I listen from Pakistani Scholars”. I am no scholar though, just an individual who likes to research my views.
http://saiye.instablogs.com/entry/the-new-great-game-part-2-global-islamic-jihad-a-strategic-asset-of-the-usa/
http://saiye.instablogs.com/entry/philipinesunder-american-occupation/
Apart from this -sorry I can’t make it any shorter; this is part of an article I am writing on American efforts to gain control of Asia – so here is a bird’s eye view of how I know they have always operated:
US global interests have always revolved around the twin tenants of national security, and commercial expansionism. Starting with the Red Indians wars and ‘The Openings of the Frontiers’ national security has meant a long process spread over three centuries of annexations and assimilations to force nations to bend to America’s ways. Commercial expansionism on the other hand initially involved the appropriation of the wealth of its colonies and in later times the establishment of alliances or puppet rulers for getting hold of bases and captive markets for America’s benefit.
The pursuit of these objectives has always been accompanied by mass propaganda to inflame US public opinion against the chosen target, while employing any means to create a crisis leading to chaos, which is then exploited through military intervention if necessary. This pattern has been repeated through out American history of dealings with its ‘friends’.
The first to face this sequence of actions were its Red Indian allies. Then America turned on its neighbors. Next Alaska was purchased from the Russians in 1867. After these had been’ assimilated’, America started eying fresh fields of ‘investment’. But America’s late arrival on the colonial stage meant few nations were willing to part with their territory for American money. So it had to be wars with colonial powers, thus America set out on her ‘imperial ways’. Very briefly this American ‘progress’ can be divided into five distinct stages:
• Consolidation of the Continental US.
• Acquisition Of It’s Pacific Empire.
• Economic and military domination Of Europe.
• The Cold War.
• On Going War In Asia.
Consolidation of the Continental US.
Invasion of Canada. American forces led by Brigadier General William Hull invaded Canada on July 12, 1812.The British repulsed the invasion; sacking Washington, burning the White House; and capturing approximately 40,000 sq km of American lands. By 1814 both sides were ready for a settlement. American ambitions to the North were finally laid to rest by the Webster-Ashburton Treaty, signed on August 9, 1842.
War with Mexico. Failing in the North the US moved southwards. Mexico –a pathetically backward nation- had gained independence from the Spanish Empire just a year back (1821), and included the provinces of Alta California, Nuevo México, and Texas. Wanting quicker development it allowed a few hundred U.S. families to settle in the area. US took advantage of the permission to infiltrate Americans into Texas and California on an unanticipated scale. After forming a majority it encouraged them to rebel and seek admission into the Union.
After assimilating Texas this way , John Slidell was sent to Mexico with an offer of $30 million for the Rio Grande border for Texas – and the provinces of New Mexico and California .On the Mexicans refusal, USA maneuvered to declare war on Mexico. The poorly equipped Mexicans were no match .The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, signed on February 2, 1848 ceded to the U.S. Texas, California, Nevada, Utah, and parts of Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, and Wyoming. The US thus assimilated over two thirds of Mexican territory.
Acquisition of its Pacific Empire. Its boundaries both to the North and the south thus fixed by treaty, the US was left with no option but to eye the outlying European colonies. The most lucrative ones being Cuba and The Philippines. So it had to be a war with Spain. Once again Cuban dissidents supported by revolutionary organizations based in the United States, started an armed uprising against Spain. On January 25, 1898 the US dispatched the USS Maine to explode and sink 20 days later in Havana harbour.This led to the death of 266 US sailors. A barrage of anti-Spain propaganda to arouse American public opinion, was followed by US declaration of war on April 25, a weakened Spain was thus forced into a war with the US.
Spain’s colonies of Cuba, Puerto Rico, and Guam were captured with the help of local rebels. The US fleet after destroying Spain’s Atlantic Fleet outside Santiago, steamed to Manila to wipe out Spain’s Pacific Fleet. Here again the US encouraged Filipino rebellion against the Spanish holding forth the lure of independence.
The Spanish – American peace treaty signed in Paris on December 10, 1898 granted the US almost all of Spain’s colonies, including the Cuba, Philippines, Guam, and Puerto Rico, -where forgetting the promise of independence to the native supporters – it imposed its own rule in most cases through use of ruthless force. Thus was born the American Pacific Empire, consecrated with the blood of millions of disillusioned men women and children who played into American hands under the delusion of gaining independence.
Emergence of America as a Global Power. The US had already emerged as the leading colonial power in the Pacific.GB though a global power always sought to retain it’s influence in Europe through a balance of power between Germany and France. This British policy – based on exploiting the rivalry between two European powers – was to lead to the two WWs, and provide USA the opportunity to transform itself into a global power.
GB had maintained the balance of power since the days of Napoleon Bonaparte’s exile to Elba, but finally lost the game with the arrival on the scene of Bismarck. A series of wars culminating in the French launched Franco-Prussian War (19 July 1870 – 10 May 1871) to restore the balance backfired’; leading to an even stronger German Empire which now also included the entire French territory of Alsace-Lorraine! GB persisting with its effort to check German influence was forced to become part of a number of alliances with weaker European powers .After the assassination of the heir to the Austro-Hungarian throne, these alliances set off a chain reaction forcing GB into a war against a much stronger Germany. In less then a month all of Europe was involved in WW-1 (1914 to 1918).
For Europe the war was a disaster which ended in its economic and social destruction. As the war itself could only be funded through massive war supplies bought through American loans, it placed Europe under massive US debt .Despite the supplies Europe proved incapable of keeping Germany in check without direct US involvement! This set the stage for US ingress into European political as well as economic affairs. The War also gave birth too many horrendous global issues, some of which persist to this day:
• European Economic Subservience to the USA. Major European nations like Belgium France, Germany and Russia were badly damaged, and all of Europe including GB was placed under American debt. US GDP improved, while the GDP of all European nations with the arguable exception of GB suffered major decreased. But even GB was forced to cash in its massive investments in American railroads and thereafter borrow heavily on Wall Street and from the US government to continue fighting.
• Imposition Of Valueless US dollar on Western World. In ability of European nations to pay of the war loans, with complete stoppage of payments in 1931, led to American removal of the dollar from the gold standard. European economic subservience meant they were in no position to counter or resist this unilateral imposition of valueless American ‘fiat’ currency on the western world.
• German Resentment. Germany lost major chunks of it’s territories as well as it’s colonial possessions and was saddled with paying punitive reparations for the war, also strict restrictions were placed on it’s rearmament. The Germans resentment of these harsh terms swept Adolf Hitler to power on an agenda of regaining German lands and dignity; which led to WW 2.
• Russian Revolution – And Resentment. Russian disgruntlement at the way the war was going for the country created the conditions for the rise of communism. Even though because of this Russia withdrew from the war in 1917, the Soviets were still forced to part with much of Russia’s western frontier which was formed into independent nations of Estonia, Finland, Latvia, Lithuania, and Poland .Resentful of this, the Soviet Union would in WW-2 sign a non-aggression pact with Germany, including a secret agreement to split Poland and Eastern Europe between themselves.
• The Birth of Muslim Resentment. Even Modern Islamic world issues with the West found their birth in this war. The Khilafat was abolished. The replacement of the Ottoman Empire with numerous Arab ‘client’ states of the Middle East with cursory political boundaries drawn and imposed by the victors; and the core being reorganized as the Republic of Turkey led to instability. The resulting Islam vs. The West bitterness, as well as the birth of Israel and the roots of the continuing Israeli-Palestinian Conflict; can also thus be traced directly to this war.
• Collective Social and Moral Trauma leading to Ideological Conflict. The immorality of it all led to trauma effecting different people in different ways. Some repulsed by the destructiveness of nationalism, began to advocate Pacifism, secularism and liberalism. Others started advocating the need for military strength leading to the rise of Nazism and fascism. Yet others like Communist and socialist movements started voicing the need for elimination of ‘greed driven’ capitalism and imperialism. Even the seeds for the national liberation movement in India and current Muslim distrust of the west were sown in this war.
By any measure the harsh ‘diktat’ of the ‘treaty of Versailles’ through GB was an unwise move; specially as the armistice had allowed Germany to escape the consequences of an invasion leaving it’s infrastructure as well as it’s military machine largely intact. A shattered and economically burdened GB-or even Europe – was in no position to enforce the terms. It needed the backing of the US –the leading economic and power broker- for perpetuation of this scheme of things. The US lacking a presence in Europe set up The League of Nations for the purpose.
But the gentle diplomacy of the League could never be expected to counter the enormous resentment generated by the harsh treaty impositions for long-and so it died its natural death! Even the principal US allies –including GB – could not bear all the consequences of their commitments to the USA. After 12 years of paying through their nose, all remaining European loans had to be written off as impossible to repay. US took this lesson to heart; and after WW2 would take more effective steps to ensure retention of its war time gains
WW 2-USA Emerges as a Super Power. .If we leave out all the propaganda and glossed up narratives of British war historians, and skip over the details of the inter play of many mini-wars which ultimately came to be termed as WW-2; as far as the geo-political compulsions are concerned WW-2 was nothing but a replay or restart of WW-1.
After a suitable period for re-grouping and recovery, the smoldering German and Russian resentment over the harsh terms imposed on them, led to actions by the two to recover their lost lands .The alarmed European powers, as in WW1, started forging a series of alliances to safe guard their strategic interests. These were to lead to a number of concurrent wars between different nations.
Yet when it came to the actual conduct of war, GB and its allies were again powerless to achieve anything significant without US support. Since Hitler’s plans of re-introducing the German gold Mark was a serious threat to US paper currency control of world economy it supported the allies. How-ever initially the US game plan for Europe remained the same as in WW-1; it was content to be the major supplier to the belligerants, and thus to build up its economic and industrial power as Europe destroyed itself. This would also enable easier domination of Europe after the war. USA therefore planned to stay out unless absolutely forced to fight.
Within one year (April1940-April 1941) Germany and Russia between themselves over ran the whole of the European mainland; only the British channel-and the Royal Air force – stopped Germany from gobbling up even GB! Despite massive US supplies –and loans – Europe once again was failing against Germany! Now as Hitler turned his guns on the only remaining non-German forces on the mainland -The Soviets – a new twist to the age old British policy of balance of power was to be enacted.
After absorbing the German invasion of Russia(June 41), the Red Army launched a counter offensive in the winter of 43.By June1944 Russia was cleared of German invaders and the Soviets also made incursions into Romania . “Operation Bagration”-an offensive in Belarus – resulted in the complete destruction of the German Army Group Centre. Soon Ukraine, Eastern Poland, Finland and Romania were cleared and Bulgaria, Romania and Finland signed armistice with the Soviet Union.
For GB the situation was alarming, instead of German dominance it was now faced with the dreadful prospects of an even more powerful European power-Russia- which it needed to counter balance ! As soon as signs of German defeat became apparent American apprehensions about it’s ‘investments’ also started increasing; specially as the incredulous Red Army counter offensive was bringing Germany to it’s knees, and contributing to the spread of liberal socialist ideals through out the intellectual classes in Europe! In this environment British warnings about the implications of the Russian success was music to American ears – especially as the solution being sought would enable the USA to get a firmer grip over western Europe; thus enabling it to perpetuate it’s war time gains of the second war .
The USA had to enter the war to protect its interests, but needed an excuse for its public to support the decision. In the end certain provocative sanctions against Japan did the trick. Japan attacked Pearl Harbor and the United States now declared war on Japan –but not Germany or Italy. However these two were forced to declare war on USA because of their pact with Japan.
Even then the US was careful to allow the Russians to bear the brunt of the battle against Nazi Germany. Berlin fell to the Soviets on 9 May1945. Later The US and the Soviet Union worked out zones of occupation and a loose framework for four-power control of Berlin, with French and British given a token role. In June of 1945, one month after the surrender, the Soviets allowed the allies to move into their assigned sectors of Berlin.
The only winners of WW-2 were the Soviet Union and the United States .Both emerged as global superpowers. Europe was divided into the US (western capitalistic) and Soviet (communist) dominated spheres by the so-called Iron Curtain
.
The British terror at the prospects of Western Europe facing the Russian dominant power ensured that the US would get a firm hold over Europe. The resulting Cold war lasted 45 years and ended in a stalemate (the détente) as America suffered the Vietnam disaster and Russia achieved nuclear parity. Both parties started peace talks (SALT).
However Pakistan after being defeated in 1971 by Russian ally India remained engaged in a covert operations against Russian and Indian presence in Afghanistan’s later availed this opening to create global Jihad’s to destroy Russian and there after demonized them to get hold of the gates to central Asia. The capture of Pakistani and Indian
economies after creating the necessary chaos in both is the obvious game plan. Like the enmity of Germany and France which gave them Europe; India and Pakistan conflict they will exploit to get hold of Asia.
Farah
I forgot to mention after finishing with the Red Indians(by the new do you know many of the Red Indians were Muslims then ?http://destituterebel.instablogs.com/entry/the-melungeon-the-first-muslims-of-america/
) it first dealt with it’s immediate neighbours before embarking further afield:
Invasion Of Canada. American forces led by Brigadier General William Hull invaded Canada on July 12, 1812.The British repulsed the invasion; sacking Washington, burnning the White House;and capturing approximately 40,000 sq km of American lands. By 1814 both sides were ready for a settlement. American ambitions to the North were finally laid to rest by the Webster-Ashburton Treaty, signed on August 9, 1842.
War With Mexico.Failing in the North the US moved southwards . Mexico –a pathetically backward nation- had gained independence from the Spanish Empire just a year back(1821), and included the provinces of Alta California, Nuevo México, and Texas. Wanting quicker development it allowed a few hundred U.S. families to settle in the area. US took advantage of the permission to infiltrate Americans into Texas and California on an unanticipated scale.After forming a majority it encouraged them to rebel and seek admission into the Union.
After assimilating Texas this way , John Slidell was sent to Mexico with an offer of $30 million for the Rio Grande border for Texas – and the provinces of New Mexico and California .On the Mexicans refusal, USA manoeuvred to declare war on Mexico.The poorly equiped Mexicans were no match .The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, signed on February 2, 1848 ceeded to the U.S. Texas, California, Nevada, Utah, and parts of Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, and Wyoming.The US thus assimilated over two thirds of Mexican territory .
@Hasan:
LOL… I’m glad you got it off your chest 🙂
Solidify,
I know!There is no other answer even Americans can give when they confront the reality of their propaganda. 🙂
@Hasan:
I agree, Americans are such jerks. But I wonder what that has anything to do with my statements and your “English may be better THEN yours” response.