Guest blog by Abira Ashfaq posted via the Peoples’ Resistance Mailing List
Pornography
I reacted with horror, and resisted seeing the flogging video on youtube, only to be bombarded with it later on television. I got angry with my mother who recounted the scene with full emotionalism, saying it brought tears to her eyes. I said it was upsetting me too much. By evening I was a bit more objective. But not really. The violent and ferocious messaging in the video was clear. Wars are carved on the bodies of women. Women are raped, tortured, and beaten to further military objectives. Only months ago, news surfaced about Zarina Marri’s torture in a military prison in Baluchistan. And now this whipping. The trauma of the girl is fathomable as the video’s purpose is to make you fathom what fate awaits the women of Pakistan: A naked and public display of fanatical male rage, backed by an authoritative and brutal ‘Islamic’ state.
Is the fear real?
Is this what will happen to Karachi? Our beloved Karachi — the city of lights, tambolas, musical evenings, film festivals, and dharnas? The reality is that Karachi is a schizophrenic city which contains class apartheid, and a gender one too. Most women of our city are in “closed doors” economic apartheid. There is rampant Islamization– the liberal kind that does not conflict with privatization, and the offensive kind that seeks to seclude women further in Hijab and the home.
This offensive kind is still the palatable extremism, one grown familiar on us since the 80s; the overt and militant kind displayed in the video is what we really dread. Is the fear real? Saqib is just back from Mithi in Thar, and reports of a new phenomenon of fresh madrassas with foreign students walking all over the place. A tidbit, sure. But perhaps the fear of it reaching Karachi is not a remote one.
Why then does the MQM’s hate campaign portray working class Pashtuns as Talibans? Many of these Pashtuns have no links with the Taliban and have been settled in Karachi for decades. Why are they manufacturing a fear against them? You should not need a mythical fear if the fear is genuine. Perhaps, the ethnic tensions find root in other turfs, and they are simply free riding the fear of militancy.
What acts of violence do we allow people to see?
Zarina Marri’s case was never verified after the initial article. There was no video footage and no statement on the record. Similarly, there are daily acts of violence committed by our military, our government officials, and our American friends, which are invisible in the media. Why are we protected from their horror? Where are the images of the bodies they burned? 12 lost just yesterday in a US drone attack. The hundred million cries of the disappeared, many of them refugees of Bajour, locked away in military prisons.
Our reaction to the video
We are offered glimpses of the devastation of suicide bombing, and now this. The reaction to the flogging video is rightfully one of anguish and outrage. It is just that our conscience is shocked, and we are moved into action. But who is the culprit here and against whom are we protesting? Which enemy are we condoning, and which one are we villainizing? Can it be that we are being asked to villanize the enemy of the United States? — The need for which is dreadfully personalized by the ugly image of a woman being beaten in broad daylight – the imagery of a rogue state sanctioning a gang rape.
Our demands vary – some demand that the floggers be tried, that our administration renege on the Swat deal, the court stamp it as unconstitutional, and some that the military take stiff and expedient action. Many of us question the legality of US drone attacks on our sovereign nation, but are not angered enough to rally against them. Many of us regret the plight of refugees from FATA, and the civilian losses in the war in FATA. We sympathize with the disappeared persons DHR (Amina Janjua’s group) advocates for, but we are not joining in the cause. Many of us get turned off because reactionary forces also support the missing persons. But does that make an illegal detention any less illegal?
Very few of us are asking for a heavier bombing campaign in FATA. Is this video supposed to sway heart and minds to that — a genocide of the people there? Are we supposed to be enraged by the suicide bombers flouting our powerlessness with daily attacks on police and other state apparatus? Nine para military officers were killed in a SB in Islamabad today. We are already adrift a river of war. Which current will we ride after the flogging?
The United States has an interest in the region, and in Pakistan. How does militancy service or disservice U.S.’s geo-political economic interests? (Say even the innocuous one like coal in Thar). Who is funding and politically backing the militants? If we are truly fighting the militants, then why are we not working to cut off their funding and their radio signals? We know a portion of the funding is from crime and weapons trade, but who is interested in a contorted Sharia rule in FATA, and how does it serve their ideological or economic purposes? What news are we being distracted from? What news are we being shown and is it to build consensus on the war?
Endless joining of dots. Endless.
What rights then are we fighting for?
Shouldn’t we then just identify with the oppressed? The Pashtuns who are targeted for ethnic violence, the missing persons, the Zarina Marris, the Moazzam Begs, the Afia Siddiquis,the women of Swat, the women of Baluchistan (12,000 disappeared Baluchis), Bajour, Waziristan — the hundreds of women who walked miles to refugee camps last fall to escape shelling in their villages in Bajaur — the potential victims of this neo vice and virtue committee emerging in Swat and elsewhere. The women of Karachi, the cities, the villages…
Asma Jahangir is right that this is a flogging on all of us. We need to ultimately build a feminist movement, which is strongly anti imperialist, anti military, and pro independent judiciary. George’s wife, Kiran, was present at the flogging protest at KPC today a friend tells me. It is not surprising that she was upset with the anti American sloganeering, and that issues should not be conflated. Its time we conflated issues. The analysis does not stop at the flogging.
Comments
69 responses to “Misogyny, Patriarchy & Imperialism”
I agree. While like most people in this country, I am shocked and devastated at the brutal flogging of the young girl, I experience such anguish daily when I hear stories of the massive exploitation of Baloch people, rape of Baloch women, ethnic violences in all of our provinces, and of course the drone attacks which we are always told target *militants*, *miscreants* and *extremists*, whatever these three words mean. One would have thought that our nation would have learned a lesson after the secession of the eastern wing of Pakistan in 1971, when our own army committed such acts of gross injustice towards the Bangladeshi people, especially women. Apparently not! All our army does is kill its own people in Balochistan and continuously fails to protect the Swat people from the inhuman Taliban and people in NWFP from the equally inhuman drone attacks.
i can clearly understand the reason why secularists are so affraid and sentimental about shariyah law and flogging.
We shouldn't brush aside this element in this controversy. The news article is 7 years old but it will give you some idea about the situation in the North West Frontier of Pakistan. This news has almost cost Rumsfeld his job. I hope Alvi Sahab will discuss this important news and wouldn't remove the link.
The Getaway Questions surround a secret Pakistani airlift. by Seymour M. Hersh January 28, 2002
http://www.newyorker.com/archive/2002/01/28/02012…
Dear Alvi Sahab,
Just for the sake of discussion. We should also keep in mind the Psy Ops. I wonder if you have seen the movie Wag the Dog. Please do read the news it is important to understand the background of the Flogging Video.
US using anti-insurgency tactics of Iraq in Fata By Our Correspondent
September 09, 2008 Tuesday Ramazan 8, 1429
http://www.dawn.com/2008/09/09/top13.htm
WASHINGTON, Sept 8: The US decision to conduct raids into Pakistan’s tribal areas reflects its desire to duplicate the same strategy in Fata and Afghanistan that led to a steady decrease in insurgency in Iraq.
A new book by a veteran Washington journalist Bob Woodward attributes “85 to 90 per cent” of the success attained in Iraq to “a series of top-secret operations” that began in the late spring of 2007.
The new strategy empowered US forces to “locate, target and kill” key individuals in groups such as Al Qaeda in Iraq, the Sunni rebellion and renegade Shia militias.
The strategy has two key points: collecting ‘actionable intelligence’ and the use of US special operation forces for taking out the targets identified by intelligence sources.
Diplomatic sources in Washington noted that the United States is using the same methods in Afghanistan.
The United States has already established a network of electronic data collection in Afghanistan and Pakistan which allows US experts to monitor hundreds of thousands of telephones and electronic mails every day.
US intelligence agencies have also set up a network of human intelligence collectors, which employs hundreds of Afghan and Pakistani Pashtun tribesmen.
The intelligence collected from them and from electronic surveillance is sifted through and analysed by US experts in Afghanistan and the United States.
US agencies also employ dozens of Pashto speakers hired with the help of an extensive media campaign in the United States and abroad.
And as in Iraq, the United States is also using its special forces for conducting raids in Afghanistan and Fata. Last week’s raid on a suspected militant target near Angoor Adda was also conducted by US Special Forces.
In interviews to various US media outlets since the Angoor Adda attack, US officials and intelligence experts made it clear that this was not a one-off thing.
They said that Washington had already taken the decision to employ ground troops for taking out suspected terrorist targets inside Fata and would do so whenever they felt they had ‘actionable intelligence.’
The decision to use ground troops followed the impressive success this strategy attained in Iraq.
In 2007, militant attacks in Iraq fell from 1,550 a week to below 800 — nearly a 50 per cent reduction. It has continued to fall over the past year.
The book – ‘The War Within’ – notes that the operations in Iraq incorporated some of the most highly classified techniques and information in the US government.
In Iraq, the United States also established a Joint Special Operations Command, better known by its acronym JSOC.
Its commander, Lt-Gen Stanley McChrystal, was given all the power he needed for hunting Al Qaeda and other militant groups in Iraq.
The general called his strategy ‘collaborative warfare” and every available tool, from signal intercepts to lightning-quick and sometimes concurrent operations, to achieve his goals.
Mr Woodward said that when President George W. Bush was asked in an interview what brought this breakthrough in Iraq, he replied: “JSOC is awesome.”
Diplomatic observers in Washington believe that a similar structure can also be established in Afghanistan.
Another strategy that the United States learned in Iraq and would like to use in Afghanistan is that of exploiting Al Qaeda’s high-handedness.
Mr Woodward observed that in Iraq’s Anbar province, Al Qaeda made a strategic mistake of overplaying its hand. Its members had performed forced marriages with women from local tribes, taken over hospitals, used mosques for beheading operations, mortared playgrounds and executed citizens, leaving headless bodies with signs that read, “Don’t remove this body or the same thing will happen to you.”
“The sheer brutality eroded much of the local support for Al Qaeda in Iraq,” observed Mr Woodward.
The Taliban and Al Qaeda extremists also have employed similar tactics in Fata against Pakistani troops as well as the local population.
US officials believe that the suicide bombings conducted by these extremists in Pakistani cities will ultimately have the same impact on the local population as it did in Iraq, particularly in the Anbar province where thousands of Sunni tribesmen turned against Al Qaeda and signed up with US forces.
Since the United States does not have plans to have a military presence in Fata, it will not sign up Pakistani citizens. But it does want to channelise their anger against suicide bombing to isolate the extremists.
The United States is also sending additional troops to Afghanistan to strengthen its presence, as it did in Iraq, and to demonstrate to the militants that it has no plan to quit the country without achieving its goals.
A thoroughly confused article. I don't understand why your horror at the floggings in Swat is channeled towards the Americans. What in your mind is the link between the flogging of a girl by Pakistani militants in a region where the Pakistani government abdicated control with the support of a large segment of Pakistani society which did not want to fight the militants and US drone attacks in FATA against militants who want to instate such a perverted system of justice in other areas of Pakistan? The only connection I see is that America is determined to defeat the very militants we condemn. We may disagree with the Americans' methods but we share a common goal with them: the elimination of militancy. You cannot so easily conflate them with the militants.
Dear Shayan,
I just posted the links for the sake of discussion.
During July 2000 General Musharraf was the biggest Taliban Supporter before 911 and Musharraf also denied this:
The Pakistan Maelstrom By Tariq Ali October 10, 2001
http://www.counterpunch.org/tariq6.html
Relations between Pakistan and the Taliban leadership have been tense this year. Last year, in an effort to cement Pak-Afghan friendship, Pakistan dispatched a football team to play a friendly against Afghanistan. As the two teams faced each other in the stadium at Kabul with the referee about to blow the opening whistle, bearded security forces entered and announced that the Pakistani footballers were indecently attired. They were wearing normal football shorts, whereas the Afghans were dressed in surreal long shorts which came down well below the knees. Perhaps it was felt that the rippling thighs of the Pakistanis might cause upheavals in the all-male audience. Who knows? The Pakistani players were arrested, their heads were shaved and they were all flogged in public while the stadium audience was forced to chant verses from the Koran. This was Mullah Omar's friendly warning shot to the Pakistani military to assert the independence of his leadership
and his loyalty to Bin Laden.
No complaints — Pak soccer body KAMAL SIDDIQI
http://www.indianexpress.com/ie/daily/20000719/is…
Taliban raided the third match between the players from Pakistan and their Afghan competitors in the religious capital of Afghanistan, Kandahar, and accused the Pakistani players of “spreading obscenity and inciting passions'' by wearing shorts.The Taliban had earlier decreed that men could wear only shalwars (baggy trousers) when playing football. The game, which has a passionate following in Afghanistan, was reluctantly allowed by the Taliban, alongwith male wrestling, after most sport activities were banned for being a waste of time. Abdul Qayuum, captain of the young Afghan Club, Chaman (Pakistan) told a Pakistani newspaper said the players were released on Sunday last and were deported to Pakistan.The Pakistani players who escaped sought refuge in the local Pakistani consulate. But the Pakistan Football Federation said that it would not condemn the incident since the punishment was “not that severe'' and that the match was not an official
engagement between the two countries.
I don't think this is a confused post at all. A balanced one? Certainly! The author is lamenting the fact that we condemn 'some' brutal acts while conveniently overlooking others. It is a critique of a society that is whipped up into frenzy once in a while and then conveniently goes back to 'sleep mode' for the next 10 years or so- the sort of society we have become.
Misogyny, Patriarchy & Imperialism.
It is a critique of a society that is whipped up into frenzy once in a while and then conveniently goes back to ’sleep mode’ for the next 10 years or so- the sort of society we have become. [Amina]
===
Suddenly Ansar Abbasi become a Mullah while loving towards ANP completely forgetting the past killing of Samia Sarwar and involvement by Senator Ilyas Bilour of ANP in 1999. Bilour threatened Asma Jehangir and Hina Jilani for protecting Samia Sarwar.
I wonder did Ansar Abbasi checked before filing the reports in Jang and The News International that Video were fake, that it was distributed by the sister of Mr Ather Minallah. Why disn't Ansar Abbasi file a news report on Ms. Samar Minallah? Why this double standard, read the news on Ansar Abbasi from the same newspaper where he works [The News International/Jang] and read it is same crowd who circulated the video of Flogging with whom Ansar Abbasi was very chummy. Protestors are very those people who were with Ansar Abbasi in his time of distress. Ansar Abbasi never flinched to file reports on honour killing but now he is asking twenty questions giving the references of Quran and Hadith. Stop using Religion for petty politics.
Journalists protest threats to Ansar Abbasi Wednesday, January 07, 2009 Our correspondent Islamabad
http://www.thenews.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=156…
The protests against the vilification campaign and death threats to the Editor Investigations
Thank you Aamir. Your foray into the past goes to show how uncomfortable we have always been as a nation to condemn excesses when the perpetrators justify them in the name of decency or Islam. It is so much easier to fall into easy anti-Americanism.
I understand (though not sympathize with) where Abira and Amina are coming from. The confusion I referred to rests in Abira recognizing how big a problem the militants pose for Pakistan and at the same time refusing to recognize that it is in our interest to resist them. Her fundamental posture in this article is anti-Americanism. All facts must bend to that ideology. America is either against the Taliban and is using this video of the girl to emotionally guilt Abira into supporting America's mission or America is actually supporting the militants to destabilize Pakistan to get to the coal in Thar. It doesn't matter to her what the reality is because her conclusion is foregone.
But as I said before, anti-Americanism is easy. It turns our attention to an artificially constructed purely evil entity. We can wave our fist at it, use some outdated anti-imperial slogans and evade confronting the new threat, the terrorists growing like a cancer in our country.
It also conveniently deflects responsibility for these militants from our ownselves. It ignores our flirtation with reactionary, anti-feminist, anti-human rights, fundamentalist Islam since the 40s, since perhaps Mawdudi.
Equally disgracefully, it minimizes the injustice that the 17 year old girl was subjected to. It minimizes her suffering and our complicity in what happened. Many of us supported the peace deal; we thought that if we gave the militants Swat we would have peace in Lahore, Islamabad and Karachi. This girl is paying the price now and we owe it to her to condemn this incident without reverting to the crutch of anti-Americanism.
Video is fake. Shariah doesn't allow flogging of married women, it allows stoning after four witnesses who haven't lied in their life testify as they have seen the incident in detail. Also woman cannot be touched by person who she can marry(Na-mehrum). Making video is also prohibited. All evidence is against this video being legitimate.
I looked at the this and other Pakistani blogs with hope of change in investigative journalism. I think Mr. Teeth is more on the media bandwagon than on uncovering truth.
Western world is afraid of Shariah and use propaganda such as this to defame Shariah.
Here is a suggestion that might make your head spin, Hamed. All the evidence also supports the hypothesis that the Swat TTP simply does not believe in your version of the Shariah.
But I have to say that if their version of Shariah wasn't scary enough, yours is definitely going to give me nightmares. Stoning people to death is so much more maniacal than flogging them for ten minutes.
Suppose this Shariah of Deviant Deobandis is up to the mark and women as per them should remain inside their houses. On one hand they demand this that only women Doctors would be allowed to treat women in NWFP's Islamic Shariah Prone Area whereas they fail to explain that if they wouldn't allow their girls to go to school to become a doctor then how would it be possible for their daughters and sisters to become a Doctor for their own 'Islamic Shariah Prone Area". There are so many complicated Female Medical problems which cannot be treated without consulting a proper Doctor and in the case of NWFP's Islamic Shariah Prone Area' Lady Doctors. Nurse-Midwives in our Rural Areas lack latest training in view of rising pregnancy complications in view on unheigenic living conditions and I wonder if these Rascal Deobandis even know about Medical Complications. They are opening doors for Quacks and Exorcist in this day and age. I hope they dont start doing what
their great Deobandi Spiritual Godfathers used to do in such situations of Medical Complications [I hope Ansar Abbasi is reading this instead of cashing the miseries of the people of Islamic Shariah Prone Areas of NWFP]. I hope he should explain the following in the light of Qurand and Hadith which he earlier exploited in the name of Islamic Punishments.
See and read yourself as to how Sufi Muhammad will solve Women's Medical Complications in the absence of Lady Doctors. I wonder if Mr Ansar Abbasi and that newly elected Ameer of Jamat-e-Islami Munawar Hasan is even aware of these complication or even aware of Pregnancy related deaths in NWFP.
It is mentioned in Aamaal-e-Qur'aani, p. 134 by Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi [published by Jasim Book Depot, Urdu Bazaar, Jama Masjid, Delhi] that if a woman has excessive menstrual bleeding, the verse (Surah Al-'Imran: 3:144) should be written on three different pieces of paper, one tied on her right and the other on her left and the third piece of paper with the Qur'ânic verse to be hung below the naval. This verse of the Qur'aan, "Muhammad (sallallahu alaihe wa-sallam) is no more than a Messenger, and indeed (many) Messengers have passed away before him. If he dies or is killed, will you then turn back on your heels (as disbelievers)? And he who turns back on his
heels, not the least harm will he do to Allah, and Allah will give reward to those who are grateful." [Surah Al-'Imran: 3:144]
When Shah Waliullah was in his mother’s womb, she said a prayer. Two tiny hands (too) appeared for prayer. She was frightened. Her husband said, "You have Qutubul-Aqtab (Wali of Walis) in your womb (Hikayat-e-Awlia, p. 17 Ashraf Ali Thanwi) What a break-through!
The prophet laid the foundation of Darul-Uloom, Deoband, India (in the 19th century) He comes to check accounts of the school. He has learnt the Urdu language. (Mubasshirat-e-Darul Uloom, and Deoband Number of the Darul-Uloom)
Risala Tazkara of Darul-uloom Deoband of 1965 claims: Anyone suffering from malaria who took dust from the grave of “Maulana” Yaqoob Nanotwi and tied this dust to his body, found instant relief.
Take the right arm of a goat after Friday prayers. Be completely naked. Write Sura Yasin and the name of the person you want, then put the meat in the cooking pot. That person will fall in love with you. (Monthly "Khalid" Deoband Darul Uloom)
If you want to kill your enemy write A to T on a piece of bread. Recite Surah "RA'AD.” Break the bread into five pieces and feed them to five dogs. Say to dogs, 'Eat the flesh of my enemy'. By the will of Allaah your enemy will have huge boils on his body. (Darul uloom Deoband "Khalid")
Say "Fazabooha" before you cut a melon, or any thing else (for that matter), you will find it sweet. (Aamale-Qurani, Ashraf Ali Thanwi)
Recite the verse "When the heaven will split.” Write it (on a piece of paper) and tie to the left thigh of any woman in labor, child birth will become easy. Cut the hair of that woman and burn them between her thighs, childbirth will be easier still. (Aamal-e-Qurani, Ashraf Ali Thanwi)
During labor pains let the woman hold Mawatta Imam Malik for instant delivery. (Aamal-e-Qurani, Ashraf Ali Thanwi)
See what “Hakeemul Ummat” Thanwi says! Keep reciting "Al Mughni" during sex and the woman will love you. (same book, Ashraf Ali Thanwi)
In my humble view Problem with activist type of Muslim is this that they think that Islam exist in punishment whereas punishments are just a minor part of Islam to maintain order in society. Mullahs’ are possessed by the Genie of Piety – Yaani in Maulviyon par Taqway ka Bhoot Sawar Hai. Similarly veil and beard etc.etc in Islam but Islami is not just the name of Punishments, Beards, Veil, and Mullahs having Bad Breath but a way of life which in my humble opinion can only be spread in society gradually and systematically to create an environment for a healthy, clean and pious society.
TTP is not Taliban. Taliban don't have anything against Pakistan.
For adultery stoning to death is for married person. Lashes for unmarried person.
Going out with Father in Law doesn't constitute adultery. In order to be proven guilty there should be 4 witness who haven't lied in their life. And have seen the incident of adultery like thread enters the needle.
Thank you Aamir Mughal for pasting Deviant sect (Shia) lies.
Can you quote page or chapter numbers?
Dear Hamed Sahab,
I have original copy of "Graet Deobandi Research" e.g. Baheshti Zewar, Fazail-e-Amaal, Aamal-e-Qurani, Qaul Al Jameel, and much much more read my blog because I am not a Shia, Sunni, Deobandi, Barelvi or Salafi.
I am just an ordinary Muslim [Mortal, Sinner, Weak and Full of Sin]
Calling oneself by any name other than Muslim is Sin and negation of the following verse of Quran where Allah has given us the title of Muslim
And strive for Allah with the endeavour which is His right. He hath chosen you and hath not laid upon you in religion any hardship; the faith of your father Abraham (is yours). He hath named you Muslims of old time and in this (Scripture), that the messenger may be a witness against you, and that ye may be witnesses against mankind. So establish worship, pay the poor-due, and hold fast to Allah. He is your Protecting friend. A blessed Patron and a blessed Helper! [AL-HAJJ (THE PILGRIMAGE) Chapter 22 – Verse 78]
Dear Hamed Sahab,
If you have any doubt you can check Saudi Arabian website on deobandis:
http://www.fatwa-online.com/deviantgroups/jamaaah…
http://www.salafipublications.com/sps/
hank you Aamir Mughal for pasting Deviant sect (Shia) lies.
Can you quote page or chapter numbers? [Hamed]
======================
There is one problem that Chief of Jamat-e-Islami Munawwar Hasan's Spiritual Father Mawlana Mawdudi and Khomeini were friends and Mawdudi had written an Excellent Book i.e. Khilafat o Malookiyat and all the books by Mawdudi are in syllabus of Iran's Qum University. By the way what happened to the jubilation over Lebanon's defence by Hizbullah? Mullahs in Pakistan celebrated that!!!! Jinnah was also Shia. You should getout of Pakistan becuase it was made by A RAFIZI.
Then how you can call other people name?
In case you missed the question: Can you quote page or chapter numbers?
"Calling oneself by any name other than Muslim is Sin and negation of the following verse of Quran where Allah has given us the title of Muslim"
it is also a sin to spread the hearsay as it is forbidden by Nabi e Kareem (saww).
Mawdudi was respected for his way of writing but later on there were many incorrect he quoted and was rebuked by Deobandi scholars.
Coming back to original issue of demonizing Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi, you are just beating about the bush quoting random things.
Can you quote page or chapter numbers?
"I am not a Shia, Sunni, Deobandi, Barelvi or Salafi. I am
just an ordinary Muslim"
i am unable to believe that because disgustingness for one thing is a result of the affiliation and connection with other.simple is that. like a laws of the physics which tells us that every action have equal and opposite reaction.
for hatred you need love. because with out love for one thing you can not hate the other thing.
Abira
I agree with you hundred percent .I do not know how many times I have to die,but I share the same pain of helplessness and sorrow,tears rolling down and big lump of pain which makes even hard for sliva to go down the throat.
I cry endlessly ,seeing this brutality.
How sad is my life.It is voilence after voilence.Women burried alive,women murdered,women raped and tortured and publicaly flogged ,in the name of Islam.
But you know I appreciate the dumbfounding silence of Swattee crowd than idiot scholars of Pakistan.
Silence at least means they are victims as well ,they cannot react.
But what the educated masses are doing for the sake of political gains or so called defending Islam is shocking.
To even consider that the actions of these ignorant idiots have any relevance to Islam or Sharia is the height of ignorance.
For the sake of Sanity
Is it a matter of Shiat,Sunni or Wahabi or is it a simple case of ignorance and using the name of Shariat law to suit ones own needs?
please for God sake the incidents have no relevance to Islam.
Torture and fear are the tools of ignorants to rule the masses.
Recognise it.
I think this all is happening every where, where ever ISLAM N MUSLIMS are…
Dear Jawwad Sahab and Hamed Sahab,
These books are available at Daarul Ishaat a publication house owned by Justice Taqi Usmani [A Deobandi Scholar] and following books are also their [try to prove these books through Quran and Hadith]
For page number of the excerpts which I have given above check this website and the owner of this site also send hard copy carrying the photos copy from the Original Deobandi books
Website of Maulana Masooduddin Usmani [He was not Shia]
http://www.emanekhalis.com/
Do read Ghar Kay Chiragh on Deobandi Scholars and its also available in English
Following books are also avialable in Daarul Isha'at of Justice Taqi Usmani [A Deobandi Scholar] and please try to defend these books through Quran and Hadith and you wont be able to defend these Deobandi Books through Quran and Hadith.
MUSLIM BOOKS THROUGH WHICH THEY TEACH HOW TO USE QURANIC VERSES IN AMULETS {ALMOST A KIND OF BLACK MAGIC as per Islamic Sharia such sciences and practices are considered highest degree of polytheism rather infidelity {Shirk aur Kufr}.
1- Aeyna –e- Amliyat by Sufi Azizur Rehman.
2- Asli Jawaher-e-Khamsa by Shah Mohammad Ghaus Gawaliyari. {One of the most dirtiest and treacherous books on objectionable and blasphemous recitation of Holy Quran and polytheists recitation for ulterior motives. May Allah save every Muslim from using or even reading this book}.
3- Asli Bayaz-e-Mohammadi by Sheikh Mohammad Thanvi.
4- Aamal-e-Qurani by Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanvi {a book containing such shameful and blasphemous practices using Holy Quran and its Holy verses for ulterior motives. May Allah save every Muslim from such books}.
5- Maktoobat wa Bayaz-e-Yaqoobi by Maulana Mohammad Yaqub {mysterious and blasphemous recitation of several polytheist wazeefas}.
6- Shamsul Muarif Al Kubra by Abul Abbas Ali Boni {the most shameful book ever written on Black Practices like Magic and Amulets through Holy Quran}.
Dear Hamed Sahab,
You are wrong about Mawdudi because in the very begining several leading Founder of Jamat-e-Islami quit Jamat-e-Islami e.g. Maulana Wahiduddin Khan, Maulana Manzoor Naimani, Maulana Masood Alam Nadvi and Maulana Amin Ahsan Islahi. And Mawdudi was refuted by Mawlana Abdul Majid Daryabadi before partition in a book called "Kharjiyat-e-Jadida"
Dear Shayan,
The reality is complex and involves a historical analysis of ISI and American collusion to create mujahidin in the 80s to the current day militant mafias and their operations in Waziristan versus Swat and so on, and actual American interests such as channels, oil, coal, etc., role of other state actors such as Saudi Arabia, the role of the Pakistani state, the role of profit and weapons industries in general,…we want to work together to gain better understanding of the ground reality, and are not resistant to understanding it al all..to answer your comment about foregone conclusions of anti Americanism.
A true analysis would not be simply to advance anti Americanism and hence lead to an evasion of our own responsibilities…but it would be towards seeking real and viable solutions that are home grown and do not involve bombing whether by us or them, or compromised local solutions which are dictated entirely by foreign donors with vested interests…rather than negotiation and discussion..
And yes, Mawdudi and Zia have done much to turn back the clock on human rights – which is why I mentioned that there is a softer version of extremism that we have experience through the 80s. For e.g. the Farhat Hashmis, the increased segregation. But, also part ad parcel, is the labor and class analysis – women suffer tremendous oppression of economic and health – and this suffering is increasing due to the flawed economic policies of our government. There is a larger struggle for labor rights and education that goes hand in hand with a struggle against unfettered soft extremism..
I believe the flogging is a misogynist act – equivalent to a state sanctioned gang rape, and affirming that war's worst vicitms are women. Just today there are reports of 3 NGO workers killed in Mansehra. I am unequivocal in the condemnation of the flogging. I simply think that Zarina Marri's case was equally horrific (she was held a a sex slave in a military prison)and there needs to be a holistic analysis, exposure accountability of the terros of our government and the united states in the war on terror.
Also, in PR we had to fight to gain acceptance that it was OUR OWN bombing we were against…rather than simply the drone attacks. It was too easy to gain acceptance for the latter position. Harder for the first because people feel the militants have to be dealt with and perhaps the PK military knows best.
Hope this clarifies.
Abira
Shayan,
you say:
"evade confronting the new threat,…."
"conveniently deflects responsibility…"
"minimizes the injustice …"
Abira's position does none of that but in fact quite the opposite. She says, "Its time we conflated issues. The analysis does not stop at the flogging"
Which is actually a call to link all the issues you seem to indicate up above as being marginalized in lieu of anti-americanism. Its a call to not just be shocked, stop analysis and have knee jerk reactions to atrocities.
You say, "The only connection I see is that America is determined to defeat the very militants we condemn."
Really? Thats the only connection you see between what is happening in Swat with the Taliban and the American role in creating grounds which not only give birth to the Taliban but is providing active fuel by continuing a war directly through bombings and indirectly through the Pakistan State and army.
And I am not saying we should not be condemning, fighting, resisting the Taliban.
Dear Abira,
Thank you for your response. I appreciate and agree with your call for a comprehensive feminist movement that addresses legal, social and economic handicaps that Pakistani women face.
Your clarification of your opposition to facile anti-Americanism and to evasion of our responsibility in this mess is also appreciated. Perhaps the problem lies in that you talk in your response about a "true analysis" of the history and politics behind the crisis but offer only insinuations and generalizations both in your article and your response. Your article, especially your section "Our reaction to the video", is full of vague questions all of which hint that America, which you imply is the enemy Pakistanis condone, is responsible either for the terrorists or the war against the terrorists. You do not talk about our involvement at all. Through your vagueness all that comes through is your anti-Americanism. This may not be your intention but this is how the article reads.
But from your response I gather that the main bone of contention between you and me is that you oppose the use of any form of violence to reign in the militants while I see no other alternative. We have sat down and talked to militants repeatedly over the past six or seven years. The peace deals have all ended in failure. After this video I am sure you agree that the Swat deal falls into this category too. Negotiations and discussions can only be conducted when we are in a position of power. If we go to the negotiating table now when the militants have exposed the state in all its powerlessness we will have no leverage and will end up ceding more land, more Pakistanis to their control. We have to defeat the militants militarily first and then negotiate. This is no time for bleeding heart pacifism when every day the militants kill more Pakistani, take control of more of our country. These people have rejected to work within the bounds of the state and have taken up armed struggle; they must be brought to justice if the legitimacy and sovereignty of the state is to be preserved. We must bring Baitullah Mehsud and Fazlullah before our judiciary instead of letting them form their own. This requires force not pleading.
For e.g. the Farhat Hashmis, the increased segregation. [Abira]
=======================
Dear Abira,
Ms. Farhat Hashmi [if she is of Al Huda] and her husband Idrees Zubair is another Calamity upon Pakistan and they are the cases of Mullah Hypocrisy, they have left Pakistan and living in Canada. I ask where the hell [accursed Terms Daarul Harb and Daarul Islam which these exploit] have gone?? These Term Mullah and Mullanis use when they preach Islam and when they see something good [what is bad in the West?] in the West then suddenly all is forgotten.
Women = Daughters, Sisters, Wives, Mothers as per Islam should look after inside affairs of Family [Imran's Khilafa Model Islam doesn't allow women to go out].
Farhat Hashmi and co is so busy in Preaching Islam amongst the women in the Elite area of Pakistan that Men of the House often found that they dont have anything to eat when they reach their houses after day long labour becaue their Female Family Members are out on DAWAH. First responsibility of Wife is to make happy her husband and rest of the thing comes much later.
Wives cannot fast [except in Ramazan] and cannot offer optional prayer [Nafil] if her husband is calling her to bed for Legal and Allowed Mating. This is Islam and PTI should enforce this immediately and should sent back all the Lady Doctors working in Shaukat Khanam Memroial Hospital to their houses to serve their family first. Membership of PTI should not be given to any Shia because Taliban in Swat dont consider them Muslims and if there is any Shia in PTI then he should be sacked.
I hope Imran Khan will follow this version of Islam because Videos of Flogging were not genuine and Talibans are most saintly people on earth so they must be followed…
@"Comment by hamed on April 6, 2009 @ 10:16 am
Video is fake… Making video is also prohibited. All evidence is against this video being legitimate."
The video of the girl flogged by Taliban in swat is showing the true face of the Talibani Jahalat and barbarism. As it is, it is immaterial whether the video is real or fake. It, in fact, represents the epitome (Lab-e-lubaab) of the Talibani Islamic Sikha-Shahi in video form.
It is like 'Udhar tum idhar ham', an audio epitome of a Zab's speach in Urdu, displayed as an headline of an Urdu daily though the speaker had never uttered these words.
What can we do now but appeal to the civilized world to save us from this barbaric sharia of the Taliban in the name of Islam as our government seems to have become totally irrelevant in this respect.
@dr.jawwadkhan
Can you or anyone else give a definition of the term 'Muslim', on which according to the famous 'Munir Inquiry Report' the so called Ullema had failed to agree?
According to Quran, Muslim means the 'submitter' who is not yet a 'Momin'- vide verse 14 of Sura Hujrat (49).
Aamir Mughal,
You said:
Farhat Hashmi and co is so busy in Preaching Islam amongst the women in the Elite area of Pakistan that Men of the House often found that they dont have anything to eat when they reach their houses after day long labour becaue their Female Family Members are out on DAWAH. First responsibility of Wife is to make happy her husband and rest of the thing comes much later.
I guess, Jahil has another name today, its called "Amir Mughal". You and your disgusting ideas. So you want to keep women Jahil so that Jahil man can do what ever they want. Its people like you, who follow cultural Islam, where jahil man can twist Islam according to his will.
I guess, Jahil has another name today, its called “Amir Mughal”. You and your disgusting ideas. So you want to keep women Jahil so that Jahil man can do what ever they want. Its people like you, who follow cultural Islam, where jahil man can twist Islam according to his will. [Zaki]
=====================
Dear Zaki Sahab,
I like the girl flogging vey much and I love to follow this which you have [mistakenly] termed Jahil and Cultural Islam:
Allah says:
“Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allaah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means” [al-Nisa’ 4:34]
It was narrated from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “If I were to command anyone to prostrate to anyone else, I would have commanded women to prostrate to their husbands.” [Tirmidhi]
It was narrated that Abu Umaamah said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “There are three whose prayer goes no further than their ears: the runaway slave until he returns, a wife whose husband remains angry with her overnight, and a imam who leads the people in prayer when they object to him doing so.” [Tirmidhi]
It was narrated from Mu’aadh ibn Jabal that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No woman offends her husband in this world but his wife among the hoor al-iyn says, ‘Do not offend him, may Allaah kill you, for he is only with you for a short time and soon he will leave you and come to us.’” [Tirmidhi]
It was narrated from Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “It is not permissible for a woman to fast when her husband is present except with his permission, or to allow anyone to enter his house without his permission.” [Bukhari and Muslim].
You still haven't quoted me the page and chapter numbers. I guess you don't want to do research before accusing someone else.
There is country wide protest for lashing because some people want to create rift between brothers in NWFP and their implementation of Shariah. Since yesterday there have been 3 children killed in Lahore, spouse killed by husband before committing suicide, spouse nose chopped off in Lahore, one killed in honor killing in Islamabad and one in Afghanistan.
The whole country is complaining about flogging video, which is fake and without any credible source.
Also why don't you complain about Gujrat, Kashmir and Palestine?
@readinglord!
you have already quoted the definition of "muslim" and every one is agreed on it.
problem arised when we try to mark the boundries of islam.
only because people want to cross every line meanwhile want to be known as muslim.
@readinglord!
you have already quoted the definition of "muslim" and every one is agreed on it.
problem arised when we try to mark the boundries of islam.
only because people want to cross every line meanwhile want to be known as muslim.
islam is not an identity its like a club with some rules which every member has to follow.
Also why don’t you complain about Gujrat, Kashmir and Palestine?You still haven’t quoted me the page and chapter numbers. I guess you don’t want to do research before accusing someone else. [Hamed]
================================
Dear Hamed Sahab,
Check my posts again because I have given the publication House from where you can get the book and please go through my blog wherein I have specific posts on Caste System, Gujarat Carnage, Hindu Extremism, Israeli Extremism, Sikh persecution and History of American Butchery. Do read then comment.
Haha! Holy shit! Aamir Mughal provides rock-solid proof that Islam not only discriminates against women; but does so on the basis of the idea that they are inferior to men.
I hope the apologists for Islam can now take a hide.
Thanks, Aamir Mughal.
I have no trouble of acquiring books, there is library too.
Can you send me link to post where I can find all sources?
@Amir mughal!
barhey bhai! would you like to tell us who you really are?
no human can be a machine.every one naturally adheres to some ideology or life style.no one can be suspended in the air.tell me about the ground you are standing.
why don't you convince others to believe what you believe rather than teasing others.
Dear Hamed Sahab,
Check my posts above I have already given the link and address of the Publication House of Daarul Isha'at of Justice Taqi Usmani [The Deobandi – Issued Fatwa to make Usury – Sood Halal for Mizan Bank].
Dear Jawwad Sahab,
By the grace of Allah I am a Muslim [not pious (Muttaqun) like you but still a Muslim]. I support Shariah wholeheartedly but question is would you like to support me to raze [read bulldoze] the Thousands of Plasterd Graves and Shrines of alleged so-called Saints [Sunni – Pirs] from Karachi to Khyber particularly in the presence of Barelvi Grave Worshippers [Professor Ghafooor and Mian Tufail should quit Jamat-e-Islami] because they went to Data Darbar for laying Floral Wreath [Read Chadar] during 1977 PNA Movement against Bhutto to exploit the Barelvi Crowd to get quci result. There is no permission of Pucca Graves in Islam. If you wholeheartedly believe in Islam then please take the bulldozer and start from Jinnah's Shrine [He is worshipped in Pakistan like Laat, Manat and Hubal].
This is my stand. Are you with me.
barhey bhai! would you like to tell us who you really are?
[Dr Jawwad Khan]
============
Dear Jawwad Sahab,
In one of your post in one of the thread in this very blog, said, that my blog sucks. I had replied no ofeence but if you want to know me than read my profile on my blog [I dont lie and I thank Allah for that] and read my posts on Hindu Extremism, Israeli Extremism, Ameircan Butchery, Persecution of Sikhs in India and particularly read my posts on Khomeini and read my posts on Shias as well.
barhey bhai! would you like to tell us who you really are?
[Dr Jawwad Khan]
=================
For your satisfaction. I am a Retired Police Officer and resigned in 2001.
pious? me? …lolz .appearence is deceiving.my friend
allama iqbal once said:
aata hey sultani e jamhoor ka zamana
jo naqsh e kohan tumko nazar aaey mita do
people are deviant not the polyetheist they are just deviant.if you start bulldozing the graves people adhere to their bida'at more strictly.
also there will be other huge counter productive outcome because of this act.
dawat o tabligh is the only answer of this problem along with good education along with the educations of the fundamentals of islam.
i visited your blog once and i saw the material which is little offensive against baloch and urdu speaking people.part of that was right and part is wrong.i am an urdu speaking person i believe that i should not say or write any thing (right or wrong) about the punabis,pashtoon,sindhi or baloch.because it only causes damage.its a sensitive and complicated issue.
if you have resigned the police job because of corruption in that department, then i must salute you.
best regards
http://rupeenews.com/2009/04/06/manufacturing-con…
Dear Jawwad Sahab,
Read more attentively the Baloch and Urdu Speaking posts, I had just replied Mr Ahmed Quraishi of GEO TV [offensive comment on Baluch Community was of him] I just corrected some historical facts. Please leave comment on these two posts which you were wrong because I want myself to be corrected. So correct me!
Leaving Police was not because of Corruption that's why your Salute is not needed
Regarding:
if you start bulldozing the graves people adhere to their bida’at more strictly. [Dr Jawwad Khan]
Dear Jawwad Sahab,
Then what was the need of this Preaching by Prophet Mohammad [PBUH] and what was the need of these acts. I wonder should we discard these Hadith immediately or what with the following Quranic verse as well:
Those unto whom they cry beside Allah created naught, but are themselves created. (They are) dead, not living. And they know not when they will be raised. {Verse 20-21-Sorrah Al-Nahal- Bee- XVI}.
Nor are the living equal with the dead. Lo! Allah maketh whom He will to hear. Thou canst not reach who are in the graves. {Verse 22- Soorah Fatir – The Angels-XXXV} .
And who is further astray than those who instead of Allah, pray unto such as hear not their prayer until the Day of Resurrection, and are unconscious of their prayer. {Verse 5 – Soorah Al-Ahqaf – Wind-Curved Sandhills- XLVI}.
And (remember) when Luqman said unto his son, when he was exhorting him: O my dear son! Ascribe no partners unto Allah. Lo! to ascribe partners (unto Him) is a tremendous wrong [LUQMAN (LUQMAN) 031.013]
As per Islamic Sahriah praying or offering Salat Namaz is allowed anywhere in the world except in the graveyards, beside a grave and toilet {You cannot ask for any favour from those who are buried in any tomb, grave and you cannot even ask favours from the grave of Holy Prophet Muhammad [PBUH]. The thing and pray which is allowed near graves are:
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} said: Whosoever desires to visit the graveyard, must do so, because it reminds us of the Hereafter. {Muslim}
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} used to visit graves {Jannatul Baqeeh Madina} and recited this pray, “Peace be on you, O’ abode of the believing people. What you have been promised with has come to you. You are tarried till tomorrow and certainly we shall reach you if Allah wills. O’ Allah, forgive the inmates of the Baqi ‘ il – Gharqad. {Muslim}
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} passed by graves at Medina. He turned his face towards them and said: Peace be on you, O’ inmates of graves. May Allah forgive us and you, you have preceded us, and we are following. {Tirmidhi}.
Only above is allowed near graves.
What is not allowed:
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} said: It is better that one of you should sit on live coals which will burn his clothes and the heat should mark his skin than that he should sit on grave. {Muslim}.
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} forbade that the graves should be plastered or they should be used as sitting places (for the people) or a building should be erected over them. {Muslim}.
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} said: Do not travel for any mosque except Mecca, Medina and Al-Aqsa. {Bukhari and Muslim}. Mean you cannot make journey for the tombs, graves and Saints for worshipping.
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} said: Do not make my grave a place for festival you just recite Darood as Allah conveys your Darood to me. {Nisai}.
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} had cursed those women visit graves. {Masnad Imam Ahmed Bin Hanbal, Tirmidhi, and Ibn-e-Maja}.
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} prayed: O Allah! Don’t let them make my grave an Idol lest it be worshipped. Then said Curse of Allah descended upon those who turned the graves of their Prophets {PBUT} into mosques. {Mauta Imam Malik}.
Holy Prophet Muhammad {PBUH} said: Be warned of the practice of those people who used to turn the graves of their Prophets {PBUT} and Saints {RA} into mosques I forbade you. {Muslim}.
It is mentioned in Sahih Muslim vol. 2 pp 459-60, No. 2116-2118
“Jabir said : Allaah’s Messenger forbade that the graves should be plastered or, they be used as sitting places (for the people), or a building should be built over them”
[Also in Sahih Muslim vol. 2 Hadith No. 2114 (also see 2115)]
I heard the messenger of Allaah commanding (us) to level the grave. 'Abdullaah Ibn Sharjeel Hasanah said:
"I saw ‘Uthmaan Ibn ‘Affaan order the leveling of the graves. So it was said to him: 'This is the grave of Umm ‘Amr the daughter of ‘Uthmaan!' However, he commanded that it too should be leveled."
[Related by Ibn Abee Shaybah in al-Musannaf (4/138) and Aboo Zur‘ah in at-Taareekh (22/2) with an authentic chain of narrators]
From Abul-Hayyaaj al-Asadee who said: "‘Alee Ibn Abee Taalib said to me: 'Shall I not send you for what the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam) sent me? That you deface all statues and pictures and that you level all elevated graves."
[Related by Muslim (3/61), Aboo Daawood (3/70), an-Nisaa‘ee (1/285) and others]
Jundub Ibn ‘Abdullaah al-Bajalee said that he heard the Prophet (sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam) say – five days before he died: "Verily those before you took the graves of their Prophets and righteous people as places of worship, so do not take the graves as places of worship. Indeed I forbid you from this!" [Related by Muslim (2/67-68), Aboo ‘Awaanah (1/104) and others]
From Aboo Hurayrah that the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam) said: "O Allaah, do not turn my grave into an idol. May the curse of Allaah be upon those who take the graves of their Prophets as places of worship." [Related by Ahmad (no. 7352), Ibn Sa‘d (2/241-242) and others. Its chain of narrators is Authentic]
Aboo Burdah said: "Aboo Moosaa al-Ash‘aree advised us before he died, saying: 'You should hasten with my janaazah…and do not put in my lahad (a cleavage in the side of the grave where the body is placed) anything that will come between me and the earth, nor build anything over my grave. So bear witness that I am free of those women who shave their heads, tear their clothes or beat their cheeks.' They said: 'Did you hear anything about this?' He said: 'Yes, from the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam)!'" [Related by Ahmad (4/397) with a strong chain of narrators]
'Abdullaah Ibn Sharjeel Hasanah said: "I saw ‘Uthmaan Ibn ‘Affaan order the leveling of the graves. So it was said to him: 'This is the grave of Umm ‘Amr the daughter of ‘Uthmaan!' However, he commanded that it too should be leveled." [Related by Ibn Abee Shaybah in al-Musannaf (4/138) and Aboo Zur‘ah in at-Taareekh (22/2) with an authentic chain of narrators]
From Abul-Hayyaaj al-Asadee who said: "‘Alee Ibn Abee Taalib said to me: 'Shall I not send you for what the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam) sent me? That you deface all statues and pictures and that you level all elevated graves.'" [Related by Muslim (3/61), Aboo Daawood (3/70), an-Nisaa‘ee (1/285) and others]
So if we cannot construct anything on the grave then how can Mazar exist, and when there is no existence of Mazar, where is the question of visiting it. Most of the Muslim Kings who invaded India were disciples of several Sufi Orders [which is itself a Bida'at (innovation) e.g. Mughals were disciples of Naqshbandi Order (their practices are worst kind of polytheism).
Imam Shafai’s thought on graves:
It is forbidden {Gunah-e-Kabeera; sin of the highest degree} to turn the graves into Mosques {Shrines}, to light Lamps or candle on Graves, to worship the graves, to circle the grave like Kaaba, to kiss the grave and offering Namaz in the direction of graves. [Kitabul Aam]
Imam Abu Haneefa’s thought on grave:
Forbidden to add anything on graves mean making it solid or making building over the same or even construct the mosque near it. [Fiqh Al Akbar, Al Mughnisawi and Kitab Al Asar]
Imam Malik:
Forbidden to do any of the above things. [Mawata Imam Malik]
Imam Ahmed Bin Hanbal:
Forbidden if there are such mosques, which are built on graves such mosques, be razed to the ground. No Namaz is halal in such mosques.[Tabaqat-e-Hanabala by Ibn Rajab Hanbali]
allama iqbal once said: aata hey sultani e jamhoor ka zamana
jo naqsh e kohan tumko nazar aaey mita do [Dr Jawwad Khan]
======================
Dear Jawwad Sahab,
No doubt late Iqbal was a good poet and learned philosopher but would you like to define this confusion of Iqbal's Mind and his poetry as well:
Please find Pakistan in the following Rant of Iqbal and if you succeed in finding Pakistan in the Rant then what happened to Islam. And If Iqbal was for Islam then what was the need of that Cock and Bull Story of the Dream of Pakistan by Poet Allama Iqbal which we have been taught at School, College and University level and that too Ad nauseam …If the Watan [Homeland] was Kafan [Funeral] for the Religion [Islam] then what was the need of Pakistan and if Watan [Homeland] was not Kafan [Funeral] for Religion [Islam] then what was the need of this Verse.
1 – In Taza Khudaon Mein Bara Sab Say Watan Hai. Jo Pairahan Is Ka Hai, Woh Mazhab Ka Kafan Hai
If the Watan [Homeland] was Kafan [Funeral] for the Religion [Islam] then what was the need of this rant by Iqbal
"Saray Jahan Say Acha Hindustan Hamara" (Iqbal)
Another contribution to this Darul Islam and Darul Harb Theory is the demented and Fascist poetry of Iqbal and I leave it to you to decide:
Iqbal on Spreading Islam in West:
http://www.allamaiqbal.com/works/poetry/urdu/zarb…
Iqbal Hindi Islam:
http://www.allamaiqbal.com/works/poetry/urdu/zarb…
Iqbal on Ijtihad [Reinterpretation]
http://www.allamaiqbal.com/works/poetry/urdu/zarb…
Iqbal's Anti West Poetry:
http://www.allamaiqbal.com/works/poetry/urdu/zarb…
Iqbal's Anti Democracy Poetry [what the hell he was doing all those years in the West]
http://www.allamaiqbal.com/works/poetry/urdu/zarb…
Iqbal against Secular Politics
http://www.allamaiqbal.com/works/poetry/urdu/zarb…
Iqbal's poetry against Women Education:
http://www.allamaiqbal.com/works/poetry/urdu/bang…
Religious Fascist type poets, Religion, Mullahs, Mosques and Religious Rituals should be under strict government control and and religious rituals should only be allowed within the boundary walls of Mosques, Imam Bargahs and Community Centres. Loudspeakers should be banned forthwith except for Azan [prayer calls].