With so many conspiracy theories floating about, who in your opinion is to blame for the Lahore attack on the Sri Lankan players today
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With so many conspiracy theories floating about, who in your opinion is to blame for the Lahore attack on the Sri Lankan players today
[poll id=”5″]
Comments
198 responses to “POLL: Who would you blame for the Lahore Attacks”
first fatima
then ayesha
and after her?
zainab? or khadeeja?
please do not use these name.come with your real ids. no one will bite you.
@sam! or @jaram or @porkistan!
i wish some day you grow up and behave like a mature adult.
jawwad@ you do need to stop acting like a weird man..i am AYESHA and i am NOT fatima, fatima is fatima.. get over it already…..
Ayesha, if we go by Jinnah's vision (and let's not forget, the mad mullahs called Jinnah 'kafir-e azam'), Pakistan was meant to be a Muslim majority state, not an Islamic state. Jinnah didn't want religion to be part of the state, essentially pointing to a secular outlook for Pakistan. It was only when our politicians started to bargain with the mullahs (who were rampaging in places like Lahore and disturbing law and order in the early 50s…I guess some things never change) that this cancer started to spread. Since then, despite the mullahs NEVER winning a major election, they have been claiming that they are the true bearers of religion and must be accommodated. Even a so-called rational leader like Bhutto gave in to them. So very, very sad. And today, they brazenly claim that Jinnah's August 11, 1947 speech is irrelevant. That bastard Zia-ul Haq went as far as deleting sections of that speech from the textbooks!
And now the very people who chanted "Kafir-e Azam" want to be the rulers of the country that they opposed. That's right, the mad mullahs of India did not want Pakistan. Shame on them for their hypocrisy.
Dr Jawad, no one is afraid of your 'bite', your lack of intellect has been thoroughly exposed in other threads. And why are you lecturing others on behaving maturely when you cannot control your language (and curse like a student of Class 2 who has just seen his first English 'fillim', heh)?
well sam i wold like to be a part of that e-mail conversation too. { labqi101@yahoo.com }
in old ages when Islam was Spreading. no one was converted to islam by force, or any other means that picture criminality.
btu Islam was Spreaded due to well being of Muslims, their care and respect for others.
well in Islam it is forbidden to say that other religions are very bad. but it is said that if you can do some thing to increase the numbers then, show the people why Islam is Good. show them by your acts, dealings, i mean every aspect of life you should picture islam so the believers of other religions can under stand the difference.
i as a muslim recite Quran.
I have reader some parts of bible, geeta and some other books of Hindu religious. only to know the difference.
Jihad means (Fight for Allah almighty) but unfortunately what Jihad is being pronounced now a days is totally different. if their is a political dispute in asia, middle east or some other part of the world, some one comes up with a simple solution by the name of jihad, come kill or die and they think their part in the name of god is completed.
i remember taliban or mulla umer or ussama, were never the issues on big screen before 09/11. and theses names were disappeared once Afghanistan was captured.
another fact is that some thousands of jewish were also part of activites in world trade center they had the minimum casualities.
i am not blaming on any body but my point is that somebody made a mistake and now it has become very difficult to vanish it. ussama was a master piece created by USA. (Made by USA).
i agree with the comments of ayesha.
Dr Jawad why you are embarrassing you self. are you an English lecturer?
this is an open debate and every one have the right to express their views regardless of nationalities, religions, languages. if you can write Dr. with your name then it is not your act but it is the hard work of your parents.
so stop criticizing on spelling mistakes and act like a responsible person.
"More sick is our Punjab Governor who jumped to claim that to be carried out by the same people who were involved in Mumbai attacks, indirectly accepting Pakistan’s local involvement."
What hypocricy. Pakistanis keep denying Mumbai was Pakistan's doing. Now read the above statement carefully – Pakistanis know very well Mumbai was Pakistan's local involvement.
Lying is difficult. You cannot be 100% careful in covering a lie with a thousand lies. Clues come out every now and then.
Ayesha and Danial,
You are telling Pakistan is not for Mulims only.
So why is
1. Name of Country : Islamic repbublic of Pakistan
2. State religion : Islam
3. Capital city : Islamabad
4. Hudood laws
5. Can a Hindu or Christian or any other religion become President ? Arent they legally barred from becoming the top position ?
Why not call Secular state and provide equal rights to all religious people ?
As long as they want to be Islamic state, you cannot be right. They have a saying, "you want your cake and eat it too".
You are an islamic state, where other religions are accorded Dhimmi status (legally second class). Tell me where I am wrong ?
Dr Jawad,
This thread has been hijacked by Indians and their facist brothers who want Pakistanis to give up Islam.
While Indians wanted to wage war with Pakistan at the incident of Mumbai and now they are trying to tell us that they love us and they have nothing to do with this terrorism in Lahore.
If these are so loving-by-nature people, why have RAW then? just to employ some retard brains who couldn't get job in IT?
Its time Srilankans crush LTTE and finish the terrorism business of RAW
and its time for Pakistani GOVT to take a tough stance againse these terrorist elements of INDIA (RAW)
Nice vote on the RAW people. Really nice! Bravo. In fact there are many Indians who would be quite impressed with regards to tactics (and not strategy!) if the most esteemed RAW agency had the ability to carry out such things. While so called educated Pakistanis are busy watching their eastern front, the snake they've reared all these years is just about to gobble them up. Pakistan still lives in a 1940s mind set, and is failing to recognize that (sadly for chauvinistic Indians) it is in India's interest to have a stable Pakistan. But, why waste our time on the internet talking? Those who destroy, aren't debating. They're firing!
Habib, can you please tell us why you are blaming RAW? What is it based on? And why should it not be dismissed as pure unfounded speculation.
I think its high time for Pakistan to revise the policy on KHALISTAN
the retards at RAW have a lot of spare time, at least KHALISTAN will keep them busy
What a bunch of idiots the people are for blaming RAW. If it was the hand of RAW, why the hell would they attack the Sri Lankan team and not the Pakistani team? The attackers knew the Pakistan team was traveling separately or else this would not have happened. Mr Teeth Maestro there is no bigger jerk than you for including the name of RAW in the options. Wake up people! This poll confirms that not just the extremists but a far greater number of so called moderates in the Muslim world are living in a Fools world.
Habib and Jawwad, do you even know fascism means? You think pointing out our mistakes and holding the government accountable makes people like Ayesha, Danial and Mansoor fascists?
Clearly, you're writing on this blog only to show the Indians down. Please, get out of your fantasy land. We have a culture of denying everything that makes us feel uncomfortable, everything that makes us realise that we need to change our ways, everything that makes us realise we need to go grow up intellectually as a people.
I see no point in holding a discussion with people who live in lala-land.
Sam, yes, Pakistan is an Islamic Republic and we do have Hudood Laws, and the capital is called Islamabad. All of that is indicative of the fact that men in Pakistan's political history have tried to legitimize their rule through religion.
Jinnah sought separation from India on political reasons not religious ones. He realized that Muslims will not be given equal opportunities in a united India where they will be a minority (democracy is a tyranny of the majority and I'd rather be a majority in Pakistan than a minority in India in the 20th century). Pakistan, unlike Israel (where Zionism is the basis of its creation), was not created for Islam. It was created for Muslims. There is a fine line there.
We have innumerable examples all over the world where a group of people have sought separation from a federation or colonial center based on its religious, racial or ethnic affiliation. Those are ramifications of decolonization for you, sir. And, to an extent, even Israel.
You are wrong about the 'dhimmi' status thing. Please quote an article in the constitution that supports that. There will be none.
Yes, secularism is an ideal. It is not a dirty word, Dr. Jawwad & Co. Wanting to live in a secular country does not make me any less of a Muslim. Pakistan needs to work its way out of this quagmire. It needs to mature. It needs to strengthen its institutions, it needs honest leaders and it absolutely NEEDS democracy and secularism.
If you guys are truly interested (in learning and bettering your country), I suggest you read Ayesha Jalal's "The Sole Spokesman" and "Democracy and Authoritarianism in South Asia". And if you have the will to move out of your comfort zone, I suggest you read "Chasing a Mirage: The tragic illusion of an Islamic state" by Tarek Fateh.
Sam, you should perhaps read comments more carefully before responding to them. I simply stated that Jinnah's vision for Pakistan was secular, and not the schizophrenic mess we are today. Nowhere have I said what "is", I've simply stated what "should have been".
Fatima, don't bother with the recommended reading, I've tried that and failed. Such people will only read conspiracy theories and and other pie-in-the-sky drivel spouted by the likes of Harun Yahya/Adnan Oktar.
Fatima,
I was told, as per Hudood laws, the rights of minority religious people are severely curtailed.
I do not have knowledge about Pakistans constitution.
Please let us find out from who know about this.
Fatima,
Keep your *enlightened* list to yourself. your prophet Musharf was disgraced or does he need more humiliation? Though I hope he would get more in years to come.Insha Allah
As far as Tarek Fateh is concerned, he can win the title of 'Sir' too, does that matter? who gives a shit?
We don't need your 'englightened moderation'.
Sam, it's not the Hudood Ordinances that curtail the rights of the minorities (except for the Blasphemy bits), but the entire structure, language and practice of the Constitution.
Yes, Habib, how dare anyone suggest READING, of all things!! The outrage, the horror! Real Muslims don't need to read anything other than that which whips up falsehoods to certify religion and jingoism.
Are you guys that brainwashed, that you will blame India for everything from a terrorist attack to your wive's inability to produce a male child? The Sri Lankan tour was decided just in the last few weeks. Are you saying that RAW had the ability to train and put 12 gunmen in Lahore with perfect understanding of the situation, and so effectively that everyone of them could escape alive? Boy, you cannot get anymore gullible than that. If RAW indeed has such an elaborate setup, would't they be better off taking down the leaders of LeT, who till two months ago were roaming about freely in Lahore? Your army and govt. has always used terrorists as a cheap way of hurting India. Now chickens are coming home to roost.
Danial Burki,
Thanks for exposing your hatered for Muslims and Islam.
So now why don't you clearly describe by what you mean by "which whips up falsehoods to certify religion and jingoism."
Karan Kapoor,
Same can be said about Mumbai incident… why would Let target the hotel and why not Modi? or Bal Thakrey? or why not the hub of Indian IT Industry?
Because Modi and Bal Thackeray have 200 policemen surrounding them. I wish they had shot Modi or Thackeray. The Taj hotel was a major tourist center. Anyway Habib, even your own govt has admitted that the attackers were Pakistani. So what is your point. It does not benefit India in causing trouble in Pakistan. An unstable Pakistan is even more dangerous for India, especially if your nukes get into the wrong hands. You guys seem to be doing a very good job of screwing yourself. As a Pakistani restaurant owner here put it very succinctly, " Apni hi L..d. se apni hi G..d mar rahe hai!
I would clearly describe it, Habib, but that would require more reading. We don't want any of that, do we? 🙂
Habib;
I bet you have never read the Koran in any way that you can understand it. Maybe you should read it in a language you can understand not the Arabic, which you cannot comprehend.
pakistan is a failed state. they believe the indian boogie-man (RAW) is behind this. I think they should accept responsibility for the attacks and start thinking seriously about fighting terrorists.
"Ayesha, if we go by Jinnah’s vision (and let’s not forget, the mad mullahs called Jinnah ‘kafir-e azam’), Pakistan was meant to be a Muslim majority state, not an Islamic state"
denial! go and have some research work about quaid e azam and then speak.its a matter of history( a written and recorded history of course)
Karan Kapoor,
Assumption is the mother of all f#ckup. So don't assume.
Thats wrong with you Indians, you assume a lot.
So I request you to stop assuming about Pakistan and Pakistanis and start taking care of your own home.
Dan
You should join RAW Retarded And Working, because their talented people have joined the IT industry and you seem a good fit for them.
karan kapoor!
english is not the mother tongue of only a small proportion of the world.but the whole world understand and in pakistan we have a masters blasters of english (like denial).should we through all the science books in the garbage?
if we can learn the english to understand science and technology, then why can't we learn the arabic to get the guidance from ALLAH (swt).
QURAN is the book of SIGN for those who can see.
not for the sumoon, bukmoon ,umyoon and people like denial the liberal fascists.
Dr Jawwad, I'm no scholar on pre-Partition history, but I've read my fair share of works on Jinnah. I'm not sure what you are referring to, please do elaborate so we can have a discussion on it.
jawwadkhan, Ayesha, Danial,
I think a muslim majority cannot be secular.
It will turn into an islamic one.
Is there a separation between religion and the state in Islam/Koran.
Also how can humans (muslims in this case) change any divinely revealed law ?
So you are only dreaming in having a separation. A secular country needs that as a pre-condition.
How can you be sure, that Jinnah wanted a secular country for ever ? Maybe he said that only in the beginning. The end goal could be having an islamic country.
Don't you think so-called moderates are denying Allah by not accepting Divine law ?
Do you thinking that accepting Taliban ruling all over pakistan soon will avoid the fighting and blood shed ?
For me it looks inevitable sooner or later. I cannot put a date, but even if takes another generation or two it has to happen.
Sam
sam_sc95051@Yahoo.com
Habib, you continue to amuse me. You've made me out to be a mullah basher, an India, a fascist, and now a Musharaf-fan. I bow to your knowledge of political science and your intelligence.
Sam, a muslim majority country can be secular. Indonesia and Turkey are excellent examples. And How can we change divinely revealed law? For one, just like any constitution, Quranic codes need to be applied to a society in their spirit. Islam is the only modern religion that has the capacity to deal with context and change. It has a system of deliberation and consensus (Ijma and Qiyas) where religious scholars (NOT MULLAHS, ONLY SCHOLARS) debate and listen to one another to interpret Quranic injunctions.
How can we be sure Jinnah wanted secularism? You only need to study his speeches and his career with the Indian Congress and the Muslim League and his personal life to know his intellectual orientation. Any one with common sense and access to unadulterated historical facts can tell that Jinnah was a secularist.
And No the moderates are NOT denying Allah in any shape or function. How do you define moderate Muslims? And what divine law do you think they are denying? I hope you are not confusing divine law with Hudood law. Hudood Law is man-made (read Zia-made).
There is no question of accepting Taliban rule over Pakistan. For one, they hold no ideological appeal for the Pakistani masses. They have been used by the Pakistani state as tools of "strategic depth", a strategy that has backfired. Which brings me right back to where I started. The state needs to set itself in order. State institutions need to deliver. There is no other way.
I cannot imagine a couple of thousand Talibs taking over 170 million people despite their hand grenades and AK 47s. They can only do so if their macabre politico-religious ideology appeals to the Pakistanis. As disappointed as I am with the likes of Dr. Jawwad and Habib etc., I'll wager even they would reject the Talib psychology.
LOL. So now Danial is muslim-hater. LOL. LOL. Man, these people don't run out of labels. Dr. Jawwad and Habib, you guys have no arguments, only labels for other people. Do you realise that?
@SAm
Is America or Britain or other Western countries Christian or secular or …?
Because in these countries
1) A Non-christian cannot become Head of state or have top position consitutionally.
2)These countries have lwas that are Christian in nature (and not secular as u may think)
3)Most of them have Christian symbols of Cross on their official flags.
Now to your question about Pakistan bein for Muslims
Pakistan was created so Muslims can practise their religion freely. i live in a christain dominated country and I CANNOT practice my religion as freely as I could in Pakistan. I cannot call Azaan in a mosque on a loud speaker ( because they think its creating noise ) but Christains can ring bells in church as loud as they can. I don't understand why people in the west think that their religion and culture is superior to others. They think whatever they do is civilized while what other do is uncivilzed.Although most of these western countries do not call christianity as their state religion but in practise, it is the state religion. You can see it everywhere, in the courts, the laws, the emblems, the flag ,the constitution, the colleges and unis ,work places everywhere.
Here in West, they encourage the parents to send their children to go to a convent or a christian school but they tell us that we should close our madressas. duplicity..isnt it?
And one las thing, if you want to know about Islam , please read some books instead of posting very basic questions in this thread. This thread is about lahore attacks and not to teach you about Isalm.
Riaz,
Islam and Pakistan are inter related.
We cannot discuss pakistan fully without understanding islam.
All I want to say is…
Taliban destroyed Bamiyan Buddha. Their hatred to Buddhist religions is well known.
Combine this with the fact that Sri Lanka team members being entirely non muslim (hindu & buddhdist), could a religious hatred be one of the reasons ?
Islam clearly says, do not make friends with non-believers.
Also Hindus should remember what happened to them in Lahore in 1947. So Sri Lanka's team is stupid if it does not consider some of this information. In my opinion, if they are stupid, they deserve what they got.
Sam
Fatima,
Mark my words.
You are only dreaming if you think you can be secular and islamic at the same time. It is not going to happen.
The society is going to tip on one side or the other and there after it is usually a point of no return (for a long long time).
Ofcourse I cannot predict future, but i have seen what is happening in pakistan. It could have been created for muslims, but the reality it is going to be an islamic state very soon.
Look at Swat..parts of Pakistan are already going to be fully islamic. it is just a matter of time, before other regions follow.
So why fight the inevitable, you might as well submit. Doesnt islam mean submission anyway ?
That is a very hard balance, and so far there are no successful society's which could do that.
Turkey & Indonesia are not the right examples in this context.
Riaz,
Which western countries have in their constitution that their elected head of state should be Christian ?
Also about loud speaker.
In most places amplified music or voices are restricted. If a christian church wants to use an loud speaker are they allowed ? Are you denied something the other party is enjoying ?
Show me apple to apple comparisons.
Well Christian convents also teach math & science and they dont train kids to use guns & bombs.
Taliban did not destroy Bamian Budha because of hatred towards budhists, they did it just to piss off the international community. I rememebr an interview bya Taliban representative with BBC Panorama at that time. He was asked whetehr he tried to pursuade his leaders from refraining from this act and he said yes, i did try and told them that after that we will have no friends in the international community. to this according to him, his leaders replied, "do we have any friends now? " and he answered "NO". So they told him what are u worried abt then?
The point is that talibans were pushed to the wall by west. And whatever they were doing was to get some attention -even bad one. You must understand the psychology of a Pathan to understand Talibans. A Pathan will do anything to you, if you push him to the wall And thats exactly what they did when they destroyed Bamiyan budhas.they would have done the same to a church or hindu temple if they could have found one in Afghanistan at that time.
And Islam never says not to make friends from non-believers( I dont know from where u get this), but it does say that even though u(the believers) will make non-believers ur friends, they (the non-believers) will never make u a friend in their heart(how true is it.isnt it?).
You referred to Hindus in 1947, well what about millions of Muslims killed by hindu n sikh mobs in present day india in 1947??
SAm,
Read the constitution of America for one example. You need to be a Christian (and not even a Jew) to be the President.
Christian churches do not use loud speakers, they use bells instead. and they are very loud. You cna hear them from a mile in the city when they ring in the evening.
Madressas also teach basic science and math. they do not train in the use of bombs and guns.Its the training camps of CIA that do this job.
Riaz,
So if they do not have friends, then they should try to make friends.
They could have asked those internationl community to come and work with them on some project or the other.
Instead you blow up something !!! Is that how you make friends ?
What have those sculptures have done to Taliban ??
Did some buddhists kill muslims in Afghan ?
Did some buddhist country attack Afghan ?
Everyone has a right to chose their friends. Just because someone is not my friend and doesnt want to become friend, should I blow something…
Anyway that is just an excuse. Fundamentally Koran says to blow up statues (especially if the pre-islamic). So they went ahead and did a what a pious muslim is supposed to do.
Any other excuse is just a cover or diplomatic double speak.
So you are saying all talibans are pathans ?
I am questioning what did Sri Lanka's team expect in Lahore?
I am saying they are stupid, if they expected hospitality.
Also who ever committed this, must be thinking that they paid their dues to reach heaven by trying to kill the Kafirs.
@SAM
And whats so wrong with having Islamic Law? or being an islamic state? when countries in west can call themselves Christian democratic republics why not others? if israel can be a jewish state then why not Pakistan can be islamic state? If people in west can have christian laws (aka secular laws) then why not Pakistanis or other Muslims?
Just see what is going on in many islamic countries.
People can be stoned to death in Iran, Nigeria…
a 50 year old guy can marry a 6 yr old girl and have sex when she is 9 yrs.
slavery is permitted in islam.
you can have sex with slave girls, beyond the 4 legal wifes
a man's witness is = 2 women
How about jizya, dhimmi status for non muslims
Blood money where a muslim man's death = 32 Hindu's death in saudi arabia
how about death penalty for leaving islam ?
Riaz,
US constitution does not require a christian to be a president.
Please show references to validate your claim.
You can also have equally loud bells or some other noise which is of the same decibels.
you still did not show me something only christians can do and you cannot do.. they are also prohibited from loud speakers.
Did mohammed have loud speakers in arabia ?
so this is a recent invention and it cannot be a religious requirement.
At best it is a culturual phenomenon. Anyway loud speakers are western invention. When did islam have a right over using western christian invention ?
Sam,
You need to go back and collect your food stamps. I think you are running out of your food stamps.
Don't worry about imposing US Constitution on Pakistan.
I thought this thread was about Terrorism in Lahore committed by RAW, but every body else seems to be discussing any thing but the main topic
Come on SAm,
I didnt think u will be that ignorant.every word u said about islam and Koran oozes of ignorance. i know u just went to some anti islam blog or magazine n got these comments from there. you never tried to validate it, coz it needs burning some brain cells and thinking, which u want to save. I wouldnt comment about what u said previously coz u know Nothing.My advise. Please go and some reading on Islam (preferably not from the same anti islam websites that u quite often visit). Once you know the basics then come n have a discussion and ask some intelligent questions. You are way too immature for me to reply to you questions.:)
Sam, you're almost a Taliban yourself. The way you understand (or, rather, not understand) the Quran and Islamic culture is exactly how the Taliban interpret the Quran. You're just as fundamentalist, if not more. You stopped making sense to me a while ago. I thought you had genuine questions but you were merely hate-mongering not understanding. What a waste of time!
@fatima!
since last evening there was some problem in my god damn connection that’s why my response is late.
There are two type of seculars in Pakistan
1) genuine seculars who had a great services in the arts and science and literature.they earn the respect in Pakistani society.
2) Secular or liberal fascist or you can call them (shoday baz secular) this new breed,grown in the dark era of pervez musharraf and these fascist believe in violent and anti islam emotions. these creatures will do any thing through which rasikh ul aqeeda muslims can defeated. they even defend the barbaric massacre of rasikh ul aqeeda muslims.
There is very easy test to detect a secular fascist. Just ask his/her opinion on jamia hafsa and lal masjid massacre and bruital slaughter of women and children.
So madam Fatima! What do you about the massacre of jamia hafsa and lal masjid?just tell us whether the killing of women and children is justified or not?
Riaz & Fatima,
Dont shoot the messenger. I could be ignorant and i want your counter points and please lead me out of ignorance.
Every one of the following i said is based on islamic scholars interpretation from Saudi arabia or egypt. This is based on Koran, Sunnah and Hadith. I am not an islamic scholar, so I have to their interpretation.
Please read the current laws in saudi arabia, which has hundreds/thousands of islamic scholars.
Are you as qualified as them ? Their answers are based on definitely their interpretation, but they are able to quote verses or the relevant portions to justify.
When you say something different from them, what is your basis and please quote the relevant to condemn the scholars from Saudi Arabia.
I am still waiting for a genuine response from you on these items.
======================================================
People can be stoned to death in Iran, Nigeria… based on Islamic Law.
In iran the legal age for a girl to be married is 9yrs (which is based on supposedly mohammed having sex with Aisha)
Slavery is permitted in islam.
you can have sex with slave girls, beyond the 4 legal wifes
a man’s witness is = 2 women
How about jizya, dhimmi status for non muslims
Blood money where a muslim man’s death = 32 Hindu’s death in saudi arabia
how about death penalty for leaving islam ?
====================
"Sam, a muslim majority country can be secular. Indonesia and Turkey are excellent examples"
@fatima!
do you have any idea what are the changes these countries are going through? especially turki.the first time in the history of turki there is shift of public mindset, a diametrical change.since many years islamists winning the election and forming their govt.the first time there is first lady who wear a scarf.
changes in indonesia is slightly different.the changes there is like a water under the grass,not visible from a distance.but i am sure in few years you start to see the power struggle between secular forces and islamists.