Location: Karachi Press Club
Date: Tuesday 7th October, 2009
Time: 5:00 PM
The People’s Resistance strongly condemns the Army brutality captured on video recently as illegal and despicable behaviour on the basis of violation of the understanding of our human rights and our laws.
In no sense can this strong condemnation be understood as support of the Taliban. Lets not fail to remind ourselves what else the fight was about besides army action. The fight was against violent intolerance and deluded religious bigotry. It was also long overdue. We are glad it happened. This behaviour, and that not shown in the video, is intolerable and will undoubtedly help in making a Taliban comeback.
Our cause is the extension of civil society, not brutal behaviour, the extension of civil methods, not illegal indefensible torture through indiscipline inside Pakistan Army.
As Citizens of Pakistan, we want our soldiers, big and small, to set the record straight.
Comments
117 responses to “Peoples Resistance: Protest against Army Brutality”
This is not acceptable based on a video floating on internet and face book you plan to set up a protest.
I don't think the protest is valid until the source, date, time and the place is confirm of this video.
Protests have become like an event to us, it looks like we come together, celebrate and let it be.
Protesting for Afia Siddiqui, Missing person and demanding the release or fair trial of all Pakistani prisoners in Guantanamo bay and in Americans Jails make more sense or protesting on the basis on unidentified video makes more sense?
Credibility is everything, we are losing credibility by calling on protest on unconfirmed basis. Be careful. Think strategically Please.
FYI BBC website picked this video and defaming Pakistan army at the same time stating that "It is not clear who shot the film or where" we should be protesting against them first for publishing this story without even confirming the source, place and time of the video. This is clearly bias.
Got to agree with Rana!…
I think i am totally with you Rana on this; unfortunately people are giving this a hype for no better reason what so ever. If these so called human loving protestors were so concerned about the way army treated those in the videos they should have raise their voices beyond the border.
If Awab these protestors are still willing to have a protest anyhow, let me give you a better suggestion, Try protesting aginst the Corrupt President. Thats a bigger issue on AI. Kicking 16 crore ppl is bigger crime than kicking one or two person…
Ofcourse i feel ashamed of how army reacted, but there is a human behind everyone. Forget it!… the protestors are going to protest no matter what.
Pakistan Zindabad!
And yes!…forgot to say may Allah bless you.
Yes, lets there be demonstrators against the brutalities of Pakistan Army.
They think they are above every thing and they are not accountable to any one.
Aey watan kai dewanon, sunn lo,
jabb mulk per gheron kee yalghar hotee hai,
sab sai pahley fauj faraar hotee hai
kia saddam kai sath aisa nahee hoaa?
Saddam kai sab sai phaley ghaddar thai kon?
Yai Fauj kai general hee they,
jinhon nai Iraq ko bechaa thaa
Wardee pahney soo-aron sunn lo
aaaj jinkee khatir tum
ghareebon ko khoon main nehlaa rahey ho
aaj jin banglon kee khatir
Pakistanion ko dafnaa rahey ho,
Bikney kee misaal jo tum nai qaim kee hai
woh tumharey liey jaiz hai
to dosron kai liey kon haram?
Tum Pak watan kee zameen ko becho
tubbb bhee wafadaaar kahla-oo
hamm, zaleel kameen chotey log
tumharee taraf aankh uthain aur ghaddar ho jain
i think we should demand the end of brutality our army is committing in baluchistan,wana,sawat and elsewhere as soon as it can be.
if we don't do it now then may be someday we will see another 'Hamood ur Rehman Commission Report' and then it will be too late.
Instead of living in illusions we should be strong enough to face the reality.
please dont delete this post. We at dow dont have email facility and we need to get this printed from a cafe.. so here is where i gonna open from there… thanks 🙂
To: THE VICE CHANCELLOR
DOW MEDICAL COLLEGE, DUHS
KARACHI, PAKISTAN
SUBJECT: Retraction of self-finance annual fee from 11,000 USD to 10,000 USD
Dear Sir,
We, the students on the foreign self- finance seat of DUHS request for the retraction of the new annual fee of 11,000 USD back to the original fee of 10,000 USD for those students admitted on the self-finance seat. We believe that this policy is unfair in this respect that all the students that were admitted into this university planned and budgeted only for 10000 USD per year for their duration in this university.
An extra 1,000 USD annually for the whole period of our stay at DUHS is an exorbant, unasked for, rise in the total fee, which many of use simply cannot pay. Our families have limited resources devoted to our education, and an unplanned rise can jeopardize our family’s financial planning and have far reaching effects on them.
This new fee raise is showing all of us students that this university is unable to create and maintain one single annual fees contract with a student of this university. We feel that we are the economic foundation of DUHS and increasing our fee unjustly is communicating to us this university does not value our contributions as part of the body of students.
We believe that if this policy were to take effect, it should be for the incoming class of 2009-2010 of 1st year MBBS. It should not affect those students already admitted in this university. We hope that DUHS understands our reasons and have a kind response to our financial circumstances. Thank you.
Sincerely,
The students on the foreign self-finance seat
All students mentioned forthwith are against the increasing of the annual fees from 10,000 USD to 11,000 USD.
Rana
"Credibility is everything, we are losing credibility by calling on protest on unconfirmed basis. Be careful. Think strategically Please."
What makes you thing this blog has anything to do with credibility? This blog is full of falsehoods and half-truths, way different from what it used to be earlier.
With reasoning you can convince someone who does not know. But the writers of this blog know very well what they are writing and what they are propagating. So it is no use bringing forward logic and reasons…it simply wouldn't work here.
Cheers
What bunch of gibberish @faisal…
Relating Hammodur Rehman to this is plainly stupidity; for god sake we are in state of a war. Protest isnt going to win us, but this infact would insinuate doubts. Ending brutality in Balochistan, wana(where the hell are you getting your news and info from). Have you witnessed it yourself?… and who this brutality of PAk army are you reffering to… maybe the PTT or BLA or what ever comes to your mind… This blog has lost his sense of direction a real disapointment…
@Ali…nice try but it didnt work thou …
@Ali
Read Hamood ur Rehman commission report and you will understand .if u use ur brain wid open mind not influenced by ISI's national security card(outdated and bogus but still running).
Let there be protests, all the civil rights people should march and have the people's voice heard.
It's not too late yet.
The enemies of Pakistan, posing as patriotic Pakistanis, want to have infighting throughout Pakistan. They like to make Pakistan another Afghanistan. If things go sour, they will be the first to leave the country.
Pakistan Army is not saint. Every army does it, but then doest it make it legit?
How can you call one group barbarians and justify the torture by the others?
There should be protests, all over the country.
This is the first video and if more videos come forward, Pakistan Core commanders would have hard time travelling within Pakistan.
All the problems are created by army, generals are involved in every mess. Problem is that those are working as police, self imposed judges and clergy.
Anyone who is siding with immoral actions against the law, would surely face such humiliation. Every political party or worker has stories of suffering by the hands of army.
If Taliban are bad, than what is difference between army and Taliban. There are four instances recorded and all faces of officers and spoys are visible, we know which division is working there and ISI and MI have torture cells and prison cells all over Pakistan. Those were abusing in Punjabi language. It is a great moment that The Guardian has posted that video, otherwise Pakistan media has no courage to display such abuses, which are under progress since creation of Pakistan.BBC is fully in support of Pakistan army actions, and that is fighting crusade alongwith Pakistan army which is also fighting crusade for dollars. Everybody must protest because Pakka Qila, Baluchistan, FATA, Swat or any place army did not care human lives.
There must be a protest. And all those saying that this is unconfirmed video, did any one of you tried to confirm the flogging video, or you just started jumping like monkeys and shouting "Oh Talibans".
Pakistani Army is bad, but the Pakistani Nation is worst, that's why Pakistan is suffering so much.
If this is a real video, than the Army should take a very strict action on this as to who recorded it and publicized it intentionally !!!,
In present days there are number of interrogation methods where the suspects is not even touched but tells the truth, I am sure that army is well aware of this, If this is the case than the question arises that why the army officer used typical "Punjab Puls" methods of interrogation, recorded it and got it published through BBC??!!!
In either cases, this video will further tarnish image of pak-army which had already suffered a lot in recent past; Even if one considers that the suspects were genuinely linked to so called "Taliban" who were involved in brutal killings/slaughtering of people in Swat, first reaction of a common viewer of this video will be same as are reflected in responses of this blog.
I think that ISPR should take this very seriously.
It would be very easy for the Pakistani army to confirm this torture video as authentic and to announce they have terminated all those involved in this brutal torture. But, the Pakistani army has remained silent. SO THE PROTEST MUST GO ON !!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have a friend who is a member of the Lahore Police. He has filmed similiar torture scenes on his mobile phone. I have seen some of them. I was close to vomitting as the police toture was beyond brutal, and this included sexual rape.
In a classical sense, this video shows beatings and abuse but not torture. During the movement against Ayub Khan, police regularly fetched some protesters and gave them third degree in front of the crowd to set an example. Tearing the clothes and baton charging of semi-naked fellows was a common sight. One of my friend got his head shaved and beaten in Peshawar … (Magistrate Sarfaraz was well known for that act)
Nevertheless, in this case, the recipients of bad treatment are suspects of terrorism and killing of innocent civilians… Though not justified, it is understandable for some soldiers to vent the anger especially when some of their comrades were killed and beheaded by taliban thugs.
As for our enlightened Europeans – well they are about to elect a war criminal as the president of the EU…
Calm down!
@Anwar
What do mean by this;
_______________
Nevertheless, in this case, the recipients of bad treatment are suspects of terrorism and killing of innocent civilians… Though not justified, it is understandable for some soldiers to vent the anger especially when some of their comrades were killed and beheaded by Taliban thugs.
______
Are you lunatic? R u civilized or have come out cave? Have you father tell about what is the status of elders. I wish, I wish I could encounter with your father and kick him in front of you. And if your father is young then your grand father. Only then I will ask you how bad that feels. And most important those kicking the elders were Punjabis so that’s not shocking as they are illiterate and uncivilized ethnic of this country. They think it’s their honor to gang rape the daughter of their opponent. They think it’s their honor to parade their girls down the street naked. So how I can expect respect for my elders.
.if u use ur brain wid open mind not influenced by ISI’s national security card(outdated and bogus but still running).[Faisal]
==================================
All but forgotten? Wednesday, 07 Oct, 2009 | 01:35 AM PST
http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-…
THE cases of the missing persons that Chief Justice Iftikhar Chaudhry had been pursuing with vigour before he was unseated in March 2007 have now been virtually erased from public memory. The trauma of the families of those who have ‘disappeared’ no longer receives the media publicity it once did or the attention of the courts. The HRCP claims that the matter still tops its agenda. True, a lot was achieved from 2005 to (February) 2007 when of the 400 missing persons listed by the HRCP 240 had been traced. Now the list is said to contain 198 names of which 99 have been located. But even a single missing person who cannot be produced by the authorities under the law should be enough to make activists worry. It is not a case of violation of human rights alone. There is also the agony of the missing person’s family that is distressing.
The HRCP has done well to demand that the government sign the International Convention for the Protection of All Persons from Enforced Disappearance which was adopted in 2006 but that has yet to come into force after the required number of 20 ratifications. Pakistan has not signed this instrument which lays down specific provisions to protect the rights of people. Among others, it provides for the process of the law being observed and the detained person being allowed to communicate with his family. Signing and ratifying the convention will serve two purposes. First, Pakistan would be making a political statement, with regard to the missing people, that would be appreciated internally, especially in Balochistan where the largest number of enforced disappearances has been reported. Second, it will encourage other states to ratify the convention, enabling the magic figure of 20 to be reached to allow the convention to come into force.
Awab,
So how did the protest go? any pics?
.if u use ur brain wid open mind not influenced by ISI’s national security card(outdated and bogus but still running).[Faisal]
==================================
All but forgotten? Wednesday, 07 Oct, 2009 | 01:35 AM PST [Daily Dawn]
Where is the CJ?????
میرا بھائی کہاں ہے؟
Wednesday, 7 October, 2009, 09:45 GMT 14:45 PST
http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/pakistan/2009/10/091007…
NOT MY WORDS BUT THEY PREFECTLY FIT HERE
"The man getting the superficial beating was a throat slitting terrorist preparing young minds for suicide bombings. Army would be demoralizing its troops if it talks about any inquiry It was NOT abuse by any standards. They were not even subjected to first degree! This is more than OK in a war zone where a battle is being fought and men are dying. ISPR should stop being apologetic here. if anyone has any doubt about brutality of TTP terrorists being questioned, just watch some video clips of beheadings and throat slittings by these TTP animals. "
Teeth! Your all time favorite topic to malign and defame Pakistan army is again as; the show of the day.
Why is it that you don’t leave single event to pass but with tethering and toppling images of your own forces.
What’s so excitement about this real business?
I won’t deny neither plays music.
This is a raid with acute arrest of many as known suspects and culprits that were possibly traced and cordoned with the help of informers.
There is a likely chance that few among the detainees left unbarred during this raid as well or you may say absconded.
There is a joint investigation team with police, other law enforcing agencies and informers; heading by these courageous soldiers.
What do you want?
Should we be in possession of flowers and ornament to varnish over these suspects who massacred thousands in the name of Islam?
How many soldiers do you think gave life as way; to cross over with ease through this growing ferocious rule of Taliban’s?
Just have one suitable figure to derange your mental thought from this asylum of rights and wrong.
More than 2000 fended you with their blood so that you may not bleed unduly.
Let me tell you; I want to be in this business as well; since I think I would have proved my self more aggressive and proper violators of human rights; if these rebellions as Taliban’s were my encounter.
This is not a case that should be paid attention or even sight as smell since this is how investigation on ground is the necessity.
You may call as action at large.
It was pleasure watching this show …I salute my soldiers who treated nonsense in real way as sense. Regards
Teeth! Your all time favorite topic to malign and defame Pakistan army is again as; the show of the day [Capt (r)Dr Razahaider]
===========================
Dear Captain Sahab,
I dont know how would you define this???
Were there any reservation from the so-called Defenders of our Ideological Boundaries [like in the news above] on these VISITS????it imposes strong checks on the country’s security matrix. [Army top brass to scrutinise US aid bill By Baqir Sajjad Syed Wednesday, 07 Oct, 2009 | 07:09 AM PST]
Where is CJ of Supreme Court and his suo moto notice???
Seven-year-old Saud Bugti’s father was picked up by secret police on a street corner in Karachi last November. No one has heard from him since. He has joined the ranks of Pakistan’s ‘disappeared’ – victims of the country’s brutal attempts to wage war on both al-Qaida and those who fail to support the government. But how many innocent people are being caught up in this? And what is America’s connection to the barbaric torture of suspects? Declan Walsh reports
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/mar/16/alqai…
Asian Human Rights Commission 19floor, go-up commercial building, 998-canton road. Mong Kok. Kowloon. Hong Kong – China
http://material.ahrchk.net/hrreport/2006/Pakistan…
Why are the courts silent over the missing? By Omar R. Quraishi http://jang.com.pk/thenews/jan2009-weekly/nos-25-…
At least then — not sure about now — the court could see through these tactics and the fact that they were a blatant violation of one of the cardinal rights guaranteed to citizens under the constitution and by the law — the writ of habeas corpus — and kept on asking the government for answers. This eventually bore fruit — though not personally for Mrs Janjua. Several of those who had disappeared turned up at their homes, dropped off quietly by their captors while some were produced before the court. Then there is the case of Saud Memon, said to be a well-off businessman and a major financier of the militant group whose members were allegedly involved in Daniel Pearl’s murder (the house where the reporter was kept and eventually killed, police claim, was owned by this man). He was reported missing for almost four years and was eventually produced when the Supreme Court began taking interest in cases of the missing. He was brought in a wheelchair, and according to newspaper reports, he weighed a mere 80 pounds had lost his memory and could not recognize his own family members. He had earlier been released and left on some street by his captors in terrible health. He died a few days later.
Read this:
http://ejang.jang.com.pk/10-8-2009/pic.asp?picnam…
Thats another barbarism committed by Pakistan Army.
If taliban kill and hang the dead body by the pole, they are called barbarians.
But if Pakistan Army does it, its called defenders of Pakistan
How can the people hang the body if Pakistan Army killed that guy?
I'm sick and tired of this blind patriotism
Dr. Raza Haider,
Its amazing how you justify the brutalities, just because it was your past association?
Let there be protests all over Pakistan and hopefully these FIR-AOUNS of Pakistan Army would learn a lesson
Dr. Raza Haider
>>>toppling images of your own forces.
what image? the bastards who surrendered numerous times against bigger enemies don't have any image. Drop those wishful thinkings, NOW.
>>>Should we be in possession of flowers and ornament to varnish over these suspects who massacred thousands in the name of Islam?
First of all, how can they be suspect and still you claim that they killed 1000s. BTW, where did you get this number?
>>>>More than 2000 fended you with their blood so that you may not bleed unduly.
NO, thats not right. 2000 died because their superiors can get more $$$$$. and those 2000s were just following orders. Just the way they had recieved orders to discover Jinnah Poors maps from 90, Karachi.
>>>>Let me tell you; I want to be in this business as well;
So who is stopping you? why don't you take the first flight and drop by your buddies and I hope there will be another video of you being kicked around too in a similar way.
Whats goes around comes around.
Down with the current and EX corrupt thugs of Pakistan Army!!!
>>>>It was pleasure watching this show …I salute my soldiers who treated nonsense in real way as sense.
Its not new, I'm sure this is in your blood and viens. Thats because you belonged to this bloody organization once. And now since you have found more ways to make more $$$$ thats why you have quit. Others like you who have not found any other way to make easy $$$$, they are still called brigadiers and generals.
@Amir Mughal
captain saheb nai sumjhaingey kiunki wo bi "ussi" environment ki pedawaar hain 🙂 jahan "NO" ka koi concept nahi hai 🙂
MUSH ne 9 years mai jo gundagi machai, us mai koi 1 cheez aisi ho jis mai wo apni galti maantey hun?
ye haal toh GENERALs ka hai, neeche walun ko toh aap chor hee dain. mei toh kehta hun ki wo fouji hee kia jo baat maan le
Alright now on a serious note:
" Teeth! Your all time favorite topic to malign and defame Pakistan army "
can you please quote the exact line by teeth which are baseless ?
" Should we be in possession of flowers and ornament to varnish over these suspects who massacred thousands in the name of Islam? "
Prey someone REPLAY history, where these not your INSTITUTIONs child once upon a time captain saheb?
Are these not humans? Are they like toys whom you grab, use them and throw them away with some dollars once the job is done?
Captain saheb its your institute which flooded billions into this GAME for its own sake (ZIA using afghan war to keep WEST not cry for democracy) and they created this massive empire of religiously brainwashed fanatics. And now when they are no more required , they have become a menace for you.
Captain saheb, if for any reasons we forgive that THE ARMY should be forgiven for its past mistakes and in future it will set things right, we would be happy but unfortunately looks like your institute has learned nothing from PAST.
Captain saheb, who helped MMA win in BALOCHISTAN and NWFP in 2002 elections? you did sir, your institute did, to make sure your double play with the WEST? Sir, kindly have some guts to tell your seniors to END THE GAME instead of arguing us on a video.
This is not just about a video, this is about an attitude. The ARMY officers have developed this attitude of WE-OWN-THIS-COUNTRY which needs a fixing if this country has to have any chance of staying in one piece. Balochistan is a good example of your institute's attitude towards its nation.
This is not just about one video sir, this is about TRUST, which the ARMY officers are loosing fast. Prey tell us your people make someone a HERO today and after 20 years make him a villain . Its you who tell us falan guy is a SECURITY RISK and its you who do deals with them and bring them in POWER. Like i said, please end this game and do your duty.
Bring me one big incident in our history, in which a COLONEL,GENERAL or BRIG. is not involved?
Its your institute who is producing people like BRIG. imtiaz, aslam baigs, hameed gulz, durraniz etc. who wake up one morning to tell us one story and other story on any other day. Altaf was a terrorist then and now your friend, PPP was a security risk then and now your baby, PML was your child then and now anti-ARMY, bugti was your YES-MAN in balochistan and he became INDIAN agent after a "NO" to your power.
You take over narrating the "SAME OLD STORY" and then do what? Enjoy for a while and leave again with more thieves and corrupt politicians over us, just to make sure you return back to your HONEY MOON again.
We know there are some exceptional officers in past and i hope there would be many in current lot but this is all about a GENERAL PERCEPTION.
The only answer to all criticism by ARMY is " the politicians drag us into their matters" Sir my simple questions is : kia aap ke 30/40 years experience wale GENERAL sahiban dhoodh peetey bachey hotey hain jo muu utha ker DRAG hojtey hain ? unke andar itni MORAL courage nahi hoti ki wo mana karain? or agar galti se wo TAKEOVER kerne ka "ehsaan" ke hee lete hain toh koi dhang ka kaam kerke "rukhsat" kiun nahi hojatey?
All evils your count will trace their links to MILITARY rules. Why ?
Why there is someone in khaki wardi behind each and every WRONG DOING in our history? MUSH came with 7 point agenda and when he left his achievement was ZERO/7 and now he is lecturing WEST (jo us se 100 guna ziada aqal o farasat rakhte hain) on what? HOW TO WASTE 9 YEARS in POWER??
WHAT A WAR ON TERROR :
——————–
People of Pakistan are terrorised of their own shaddows.
Clearly there are many issues in Pakistan at present .
Afghanistan issue.
Co-operation with the coalation forces
Role of army in the government
Actions of civil government
Now Judiciary is like the chaudhry of the pind rather than the JUDGE
———-
The crux of all problems is people of Pakistan have no faith what so ever on civil or military rules any more.
—–
the second point is all the institutions are corrupt (or considered so by the people) and do not
command respect.
——
Now everything from Kerry-Lugar bill ,to missing people,to journalistic tapes,no availablity of sugar and atta ,
EVERY ISSUE is an issue of a common person.
WHO WOULD TAKE A STAND ON IT?
Parliament?Army?Judiciary everyone is silent on all major issues.
Even the opposition is silent
—————–
people of Pakitan should demand their rights.
Stand outsid ethe parliament ,stand outside the Corridors of justice untill you get your answers.
Stand outside the News papers offices and TV centres
until they subdue.
—————
subdue THE ARMY ,subdue THE JUDICIARY,subdue the President and Prime Minister
People of Pakistan have to take a STAND for themselves,stand up for your rights,for your votes and stand up for your openion.
———–
I see no solution to the crises of Pakistan apart from ,civil movement .
Alright now on a serious note:
" Teeth! Your all time favorite topic to malign and defame Pakistan army "
can you please quote the exact line by teeth which are baseless ?
" Should we be in possession of flowers and ornament to varnish over these suspects who massacred thousands in the name of Islam? "
Prey someone REPLAY history, where these not your INSTITUTIONs child once upon a time captain saheb?
Are these not humans? Are they like toys whom you grab, use them and throw them away with some dollars once the job is done?
Captain saheb its your institute which flooded billions into this GAME for its own sake (ZIA using afghan war to keep WEST not cry for democracy) and they created this massive empire of religiously brainwashed fanatics. And now when they are no more required , they have become a menace for you.
Captain saheb, if for any reasons we forgive that THE ARMY should be forgiven for its past mistakes and in future it will set things right, we would be happy but unfortunately looks like your institute has learned nothing from PAST.
Captain saheb, who helped MMA win in BALOCHISTAN and NWFP in 2002 elections? you did sir, your institute did, to make sure your double play with the WEST? Sir, kindly have some guts to tell your seniors to END THE GAME instead of arguing us on a video.
This is not just about a video, this is about an attitude. The ARMY officers have developed this attitude of WE-OWN-THIS-COUNTRY which needs a fixing if this country has to have any chance of staying in one piece. Balochistan is a good example of your institute's attitude towards its nation.
This is not just about one video sir, this is about TRUST, which the ARMY officers are loosing fast. Prey tell us your people make someone a HERO today and after 20 years make him a villain. Its you who tell us falan guy is a SECURITY RISK and its you who do deals with them and bring them in POWER. Like i said, please end this game and do your duty.
Bring me one big incident in our history, in which a COLONEL,GENERAL or BRIG. is not involved?
Its your institute who is producing people like BRIG. imtiaz, aslam baigs, hameed gulz, durraniz etc. who wake up one morning to tell us one story and other story on any other day. Altaf was a terrorist then and now your friend, PPP was a security risk then and now your baby, PML was your child then and now anti-ARMY, bugti was your YES-MAN in balochistan and he became INDIAN agent after a "NO" to your power.
You keep over narrating the "SAME OLD STORY" and then do what? Enjoy for a while and leave again with more thieves and corrupt politicians over us, just to make sure you return back to your HONEY MOON again.
We know there are some exceptional officers in past and i hope there would be many in current lot but this is all about a GENERAL PERCEPTION.
The only answer to all criticism by ARMY is " the politicians drag us into their matters" Sir my simple questions is : kia aap ke 30/40 years experience wale GENERAL sahiban dhoodh peetey bachey hotey hain jo muu utha ker DRAG hojtey hain ? unke andar itni MORAL courage nahi hoti ki wo mana karain? or agar galti se wo TAKEOVER kerne ka "ehsaan" ke hee lete hain toh koi dhang ka kaam kerke "rukhsat" kiun nahi hojatey?
All evils your count will trace their links to MILITARY rules. Why ?
Why there is someone in khaki wardi behind each and every WRONG DOING in our history? MUSH came with 7 point agenda and when he left his achievement was ZERO/7 and now he is lecturing WEST (jo us se 100 guna ziada aqal o farasat rakhte hain) on what? HOW TO WASTE 9 YEARS in POWER??
Teeth! Your all time favorite topic to malign and defame Pakistan army is again as; the show of the day [Capt (r)Dr Razahaider]
=======================
Captain saheb its your institute which flooded billions into this GAME for its own sake (ZIA using afghan war to keep WEST not cry for democracy) and they created this massive empire of religiously brainwashed fanatics. [MB]
=========================
Military’s Establishment “concerns” over Kerry-Luger Bill is not about Country’s Sovereignty but Power Politics!!!
example:
Pakistani Military used to Support Taliban, Several Sectarian Outfits and Lashkar-e-Tayyaba before 911? And while the Sipah-e-Sahaba Pakistan and the Lashkar-e-Jhangvi stand officially disbanded, their most militant son and leader, Maulana Azam Tariq, an accused in several cases of sectarian killing, contested elections from jail – albeit as an independent candidate – won his seat, and was released on bail shortly thereafter. Musharraf rewrote election rules to disqualify former Prime Ministers Mohammed Nawaz Sharif and Benazir Bhutto, and threatened to toss them in jail if they returned from abroad, which badly undermined both Nawaz Sharif's Pakistan Muslim League and Bhutto's Pakistan People's Party (PPP). Musharraf has plainly given the religious groups more free rein in the campaign than he has allowed the two big parties that were his main rivals. In Jhang city, in Punjab province, Maulana Azam Tariq, leader of an outlawed extremist group called Sipah-e-Sahaba, which has been linked to numerous sectarian killings, is being allowed to run as an independent�despite election laws that disqualify any candidate who has criminal charges pending, or even those who did not earn a college degree. "It makes no sense that Benazir can't run in the election," says one Islamabad-based diplomat, "and this nasty guy can."
References: And this takes me back to Pervez Musharraf’s first visit to the US after his coup. At a meeting with a group of journalists among whom I was present, my dear and much lamented friend Tahir Mirza, then the Dawn correspondent, asked Musharraf why he was not acting against Lashkar-e Tayba and Jaish-e Muhammad. Musharraf went red in the face and shot back, “They are not doing anything in Pakistan. They are doing jihad outside.” Pakistani neocons and UN sanctions Khalid Hasan This entry was posted on Sunday, December 28th, 2008 at 6:00 pm.
http://www.khalidhasan.net/2008/12/28/pakistani-n…
For The 'General' Good By Sairah Irshad Khan Monthly Newsline January 2003
http://www.newsline.com.pk/newsJan2003/cover1jan2… –
General's Election
By TIM MCGIRK / KHANA-KHEL Monday, Oct. 07, 2002 http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,…
Teeth! Your all time favorite topic to malign and defame Pakistan army is again as; the show of the day [Capt (r)Dr Razahaider]
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Dear Captain Sahab,
Enjoy the picture below [click the link] and save it for hanging in Military Academy Kakul
Military’s Establishment “concerns” over Kerry-Luger Bill is not about Country’s Sovereignty but Power Politics!!!
Islamic militancy is a foreign policy tool of the US and
Pakistani establishments Download this article By Yousuf Nazar http://www.yousufnazar.com/?p=777
Admiral Mike Mullen (first from left), the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, Pakistani Army Chief Gen. Pervez Kayani (third from the left) and next to him, the ISI Chief Ahmed Shuja Pasha (then Major. Gen. and Director General Military Operations) aboard the US naval carrier Abraham Lincoln in Indian Ocean; in a secret meeting on August 26, 2008. Pasha was promoted to the rank of Lt. Gen. and appointed as the head of the Inter-Services Intelligence on Sept. 29, 2008. –
Teeth! Your all time favorite topic to malign and defame Pakistan army is again as; the show of the day [Capt (r)Dr Razahaider]
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Pakistan: the army as the state Ehsan Masood, 12 – 04 – 2007
Pakistan’s economy and institutions are deeply penetrated by the country’s army, a new book and documentary film reveal. Ehsan Masood reports 12 – 04 – 2007
http://www.opendemocracy.net/globalization-india_…
Note: Link is dead therefor pardon for full text! The article was published in The News International
Where has US aid to Pakistan gone? Mariana Baabar [Jun 2007]
ISLAMABAD : The billions of dollars in US military aid to Pakistan since September 11, 2001, without any accountability, has now been billed as a “tsunami of new funding”.
Washington’s Centre for Public Integrity, in its report, says that today human rights activists, critics of the Pakistani government and members of Congress want to know, where most of the money — totalling in the billions — coming through a Defence Department programme, subject to virtually no Congressional oversight, has disappeared to.
The Centre says that this is a major finding of more than a year of investigation by the Centre for Public Integrity’s International Consortium of Investigative Journalists (ICIJ). US military aid to Pakistan since September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks includes almost $5 billion in coalition support funds, a programme controlled by the Defence Department to reimburse key allies in the global war on terror. Pentagon reports that the ICIJ obtained through the Freedom of Information Act requests show that Pakistan is the No 1 recipient of these funds — receiving more than 10 times the amount that went to the No 2 recipient, Poland — and that there is scant documentation of how the money was used.
Pakistan also benefited from other funding mechanisms set up in the aftermath of the 2001 attacks. In three years after the attacks, Pakistan was the third-largest recipient of the Pentagon’s new regional defence counter terrorism fellowship programme, designed to train foreign forces in counter terrorism techniques. More than $23 million was earmarked for Pakistan in fiscal 2006 for “improving counter terrorism strike capabilities” under another new Pentagon programme referred to colloquially as Section 1206 training, which allows the Pentagon to use a portion of its annual funding from Congress to train and equip foreign militaries. Pakistan finished first in the race for this new Pentagon-controlled training.
The US State Department rates Pakistan’s human rights record as poor and reports a long litany of abuses. That nourishes critics’ claims that the US largesse has been put to abusive purposes, including to buy weapons that have been turned against Pakistani civilians and to offer bounties on suspects the US is seeking. According to Senator Sana Baloch, an opposition lawmaker who fled the country out of safety concerns, the US has several military bases inside Pakistan, including some in the senator’s home province of Balochistan. “Most of the US bases are based in Balochistan,” Baloch told ICIJ in an interview. “One or two of them are in Kharan, my own home district. The US is using the bases in this area for the war on terror. We are very supportive of the US in this role.”
The majority of the new US funding to Pakistan has come in the form of billions of dollars of coalition support funds (CSF), a post-9/11 funding mechanism created to reimburse key countries for expenses incurred in supporting American counter terrorism operations. According to K Alan Kronstadt, an expert on South Asia at the Congressional research service, by August 2006, CSF accounted for roughly $4.75 billion of the military aid Pakistan received from the US since the terrorist attacks. Pentagon documents obtained by ICIJ say the money that went to Pakistan was largely for “military operations on the Afghanistan border.”
Coalition support funds are considered a reimbursement by some and a blank check by others. Craig Cohen, the co-author of a recent Centre for Strategic and International Study on US aid to Pakistan, asked rhetorically whether CSF money is “intended to yield some sort of specific action on the part of the government,” adding, “If so, there’s clearly no oversight.”
Olga Oliker, an expert on US defence policy and co-author of a recent RAND think tank report on the human rights performance of internal security forces in South Asia, said she’s concerned that US-made weapons that go to Pakistani security forces and US training that the forces receive are being used against civilian populations. “In implementing assistance,” she told ICIJ, “the US has paid relatively little attention to human rights abuses and oversight. People weren’t paying attention.”
The new Democratic-controlled Congress has taken a greater interest in CSF payments to Pakistan. Under the previous GOP majority, there was virtually no oversight of CSF payments to any country. In January 2007, the House of Representatives acted to impose conditions on military aid to Pakistan by adopting the Implementing the 9/11 Commission Recommendations Act of 2007. Section 1442 of the bill relates to Pakistan. It identifies areas of concern for US policy, including the need for Pakistan to curb the proliferation of nuclear technology, to address the presence of the Taliban and other extremist forces and to secure its borders to prevent movement of terrorists. The bill would impose limits on foreign assistance to Pakistan, declaring that the US assistance may not be approved until “the president determines and certifies to the appropriate Congressional committees that the government of Pakistan is making all possible efforts to prevent the Taliban from operating in areas under its sovereign control. “In addition, Pakistan would be required to demonstrate that it is making significant steps toward free and fair parliamentary elections in 2007.” The bill also requires that the president submit a report describing the long-term strategy of US engagement with Pakistan.
“The American-supplied military arsenal has been used against Baloch nationalists,” Senator Baloch told ICIJ. He said he and others have gone to the State Department, “and the State Department says [the US has] given military hardware with no conditions.” A former US official, previously based in Pakistan, acknowledged to the ICIJ that in Balochistan “the [Pakistani] army stepped in with a pretty heavy hand last year.”
Teeth! Your all time favorite topic to malign and defame Pakistan army is again as; the show of the day [Capt (r)Dr Razahaider]
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ye haal toh GENERALs ka hai, neeche walun ko toh aap chor hee dain. mei toh kehta hun ki wo fouji hee kia jo baat maan le [MB]
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Memorable Quotes on Perverted Military Mentality!
Note: Dear Captain Sahab,
Save it for Military Academy Kakul and include in ISSB:
Army is a queer institution. There is no innocence, goodwill and hope in the intentions and actions of the men in uniform. They are least to be trusted. When they pontificate they lie. With them any idea of integrity becomes a falsehood. When a man in uniform lectures and becomes rumbustious, he always talk through his hat. Talking Generals are always ominous intellectual perverts.
Chasterton had said, “I would hate to see a man in uniform make a speech, more so, if it is a good speech.”
‘Sir Walter Scott had said, “However disciplined and valiant a soldier he never be trusted.”
H G Wells had said, “A professional military mind is by necessity an inferior and unimaginative mind; and no man with talents willingly imprison his gifts in such a calling.”
Bertrand Russell had said, “All Generals are narcissistic and they have no sense of history.”
Bernard Shaw said, “Soldiering is the art of the coward of hitting mercilessly when strong and getting out of the harms when weak.”
Tolstoy had said, “The greatest Generals I have met were all stupid and absentminded men”.
Napolean had said, “The more vicious the man the better the soldier.” He again said, “I had picked up my Marshals from the mud and gutter”.
Johnson had said, Soldiers and priests have been the corrupter of the earth.”
“Like the Duke of Wellington and Marshall Bluchure, Ayub and Yahyah gave military commissions to the sons of mothers who spent nights or adequate time in their bedrooms. Our army selection boards are scandalous to say the least in their proceedings and methods.
Late. General Gul Hassan the Chief of Army Staff to Military Garrison at Malir – the honest confession in the most direct and perverted language of a soldier. After the Great War with the blessings of both General Montgomery and Arch Bishop of Canterbury, England passed the law “Homosexuality among consenting adults in private is permissible.”
For further details:
Pakistan Military mind-set by Hamid Hussain – Defence Journal Monthly 2002
http://chagataikhan.blogspot.com/2009/05/pakistan…
Aamir Mughal:
I wonder why you could only come up with centuries old quotes. They may be true at the time they were said. To comment on the issues of the present, I would stick to the facts and figures of the present and not take refuge in outdated personal ideas. Makes sense to you?
To comment on the issues of the present, I would stick to the facts and figures of the present and not take refuge in outdated personal ideas. [Unaiza Fatima]
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Please suggest
To comment on the issues of the present, I would stick to the facts and figures of the present and not take refuge in outdated personal ideas. [Unaiza Fatima]
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Well-deserved comeuppance By Kamran Shafi March 11, 2008
http://www.dawn.com/weekly/kamran/20081103.htm
It is this establishment I speak about, it is this establishment that can do anything to follow, dog-like, its various godfathers’ bidding.
Which immediately takes us to a rather disconcerting happening just the other day, a happening that was inappropriate at the very least, and at its worst, direct interference in the country’s politics by the Chief of Army Staff.
And that was the statement by the COAS as reported in the press: “Chief of the Army Staff General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani announced on Thursday his institution’s complete support for the elected government and the democratic process. However, he called for avoiding schism between various pillars of the state and dispelled a perception that the army was distancing itself from the president.”
While it is good and proper that the army will completely support the elected government, was it not absolutely inappropriate for him to call for “avoiding schism between various pillars of the state” and for saying that “the army was not distancing itself from the president”.
May one ask what happens if the elected representatives of the people were to impeach Musharraf? Or if the resurrected judiciary were to rule that Musharraf’s election was illegal and unconstitutional? What about the ‘schism’ then? When the COAS speaks about the ‘pillars of state’ does he consider that the person of Musharraf is one such ‘pillar’ in spite of the fact that he was ‘elected’ president under Emergency rule, an act Musharraf himself said was unconstitutional? What was the point in saying anything at all?
No sirs, it is high time that you went back to your training areas and firing ranges and exercise grounds and became the professional army you were before the Commando’s loving ministrations. And, indeed, to the Year of the Soldier after so many Decades of the General. And please keep your noses out of politics; I assure you we bloody civilians can manage the country’s affairs better than 22 Commandos put together.
Now where is that NGO lady Samar MinAllah who was busy in bitching about a “Sawati Flogging VIdeo”? [Adnan Siddiqi]
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Sir,
She is with her brother Ather Minallah [Former Spokesman of CJ Iftikhar Muhammad Chaudhry] and also served General Musharraf's Martial Law Cabinet of NWFP from 2000 to 2002 as Provincial Minister.
So much for invoking article 6 against Musharraf for Treason Trail against him. An accomplice is a person who actively participates in the commission of a crime, even though they take no part in the actual criminal offense.
As per 1973 Constitution of Islamic Republic of Pakistan
PART I
6. (1) Any person who abrogates or attempts or conspires to abrogate, subverts or attempts or conspires to subvert the Constitution by use of force or show of force or by other unconstitutional means shall be guilty of high treason.
(2) Any person aiding or abetting the acts mentioned in clause (1) shall likewise be guilty of high treason.
(3) [Majlis-e-Shoora (Parliament)] shall by law provide for the punishment of persons found guilty of high treason.
People,
Cut the army some slack.
As you all know only the most inept join the army (no insult inteded) . Anyone with any real ability becomes a doctor, engineer, business man whatever. I have not seen anyone in the last 25 years join the military if they had another option. Only the worst student from my school joined the army (ok.some bright guys join the army doctors core or the engineer but not for actual infantry or fighting divisions).
So what do you expect from these people? They are going to be just as competent as our police, which again is formed with not exact grade A candidates. How else do you expect them to investigate except torture. They are not exactly Sherlock Homes smart. They just dont have the capacity to do anything else (like our police).
Anyone who thinks these guys can do anything half way competently should get their head examined themselves. Its not that they are at fault. Your whole selection methodolgy is such that you gurantee an army of mentally challenged individuals.
I shudder to think what more these guys are going to get us into. To think the future of the free world and of Pakistan depends on them.
Leaving aside the fact that the timing of this video's release is quite dubious I would say any one who harbors people who bomb us, slit our children's throats and want to destroy us as a nation deserve no less than what we see.
Go Pak Army, down with the fucking Taliban, whatever it takes!!
People protesting this video : Did you protest when the Taliban just attacked and killed 5 people inside the WFP building in the U.N?
@skeptic
I will dare deviate slightly from your views above saying that YES majority of the fellows who join ARMY do it for known reasons (not having other option, no enough money to apply for higher studies here in PAKISTAN in private universities or abroad, little investment-high return logic etc.) but there are some fellows who join it as passion too (very few) and i have few fellows who are competent too but the problem is THIS:
The age and position they join ARMY doesnt allow them to think at their own and thus when they reach a position of POWER PLAY they have been BRAINWASHED enough by the institute to act like all others in their lot.
YOu can call it THE IRONY of the CLASS (army class ). Very few and exceptional (read professional thoroughly) officers will be able to escape this brainwashing.
Now where is that NGO lady Samar MinAllah who was busy in bitching about a “Sawati Flogging VIdeo”? [Adnan Siddiqi]
==========================
Documentary presents dark side of migration By A Reporter Friday, 09 Oct, 2009 | 07:12 AM PST
http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-…
ISLAMABAD, Oct 8: Samar Minallah took another bold step on Thursday by premiering her latest documentary: “The Dark Side of Migration” at the South Asia Policy Analysis Network. Her last work, reproduction of a video about flogging of a Swati girl, had sparked controversary about six months ago. Although the 25-minute documentary has a misleading title, it is on human trafficking from a number of poor countries like Bangladesh, may be India and Pakistan. The documentary states how a woman from Rahimyar Khan was snared in vile business of sex abuse, which ultimately ends in prostitution.
I have not seen the film but how come prostitution is linked with Dark side of Migration????
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Elopement in Pakistan/India/ Bangladesh /Iran would result mostly in a man abandoning a woman.Yes it is a man's world and hostile one,prostitudes around the world are beaten,abused and strangled?
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Sorry i do not see the link between migration and prostitution?
Samar should know this?For long she has been working with the displaced women of Afghanistan……….where many women commit suicide than stepping into forced prostitution?
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Dear Dr Awab Alvi…
After having a look of your second post regarding the video of Pakistan Army, i doubt you to be a taliban paying you heavily!!
Please dont make people hate their army, because its the army who defends while you sleep, who is there in swat, while you enjoying making propaganda against your own army!!!
Ever thought of receiving you brother, course mate or colleague body with out head? with cut body parts?? no, no you even cant imagine it!! Pak Army has seen it!
Believe me this is not even a point percent of what taliban do with local people and army!!
this is not even equivilent to point percent of a single drop of those mothers whose sons ahve laid their lives in fighting with taliban in Operation Rah-e-rast!
Dr Awab, it very easy to write a blog, but its very hard to look the mother having tears in her eyes, a father who is receiving his young son's body!
Dr Awab, Please stop it! dont make the job of talibans easy!
Dr. Awab Alvi,
Thank you for posting this video. One can imagine an army in a third-world-country, all-powerful, yet some citizens have courage to take the stand.
I don't salute Pakistan Army, I salute you. I hope you don't come in the harms way, because you are exposing this.
The people who are not themselves on Rah-e-Rast how can bring others to this rah-e-rast.
Its a shame, these bastards were never held accountable. Every time there is an enemy bigger than these bastards, they surrender without shame.
Yet, when it comes to making money they are along the other corrupt feudal lords of our society.
Pakistan Army (Pakistani Black Water) thrives on free-money.
The bigger an officer is a chuttoo, the higher the rank he climbs in the ranks. Yes there are exceptions, but thats the BEST PRACTICE in this org.
I know these Indian bastards are enjoying the feast-reading these sentiments, but what can I do, I never wanted to utter these words against Pakistan Army, but for how long? They have sold this country for a few plots
we must support Pak army as we are totally dependent on them not on our third rated politician
Salman,
You go support Pakistan army with your buddy Zaid Hamid Kezzab.
I do not support brutalities and I DO NOT SUPPORT PAKISTAN ARMY.
I pray that Allah cleanse Pakistan army from the filth that is currently running Pakistan Army who disgraced Dr.AQ Khan and sold many other Pakistanis just for $$$$$$.